Ph wasn't what I thought it was

[John Vinson]

I've been blissfully unaware for a while now (the API test kit has always said I have a Ph of 8.2) - which is at odds with what my new Apex is reporting (7.4-7.7).  I'd like to bump it up to 8.3 and have it remain there.  Is the best way to do that a CO2 scrubber attached to my skimmer, or is there another way that I'm once again, blissfully unaware of!?   Does anyone do anything like dose sodium bicarbonate or kalkwasser to their ATO water, for example?  I'm just hesitant to go with the CO2 scrubber based on the cost/frequency of the media changes, unless absolutely necessary.  As always, thanks in advance for your help!

[Parzifal]

Have you calibrated the sensors on the apex?  
 

mine showed 5.4 when I first plugged it in and over a week rose up to 8.1

dont chase the numbers!  If everything is healthy always a good caution to test with another kit to verify a result before changing your routine

[John Vinson]

1 minute ago, Parzifal said:

Have you calibrated the sensors on the apex?  
 

mine showed 5.4 when I first plugged it in and over a week rose up to 8.1

dont chase the numbers!  If everything is healthy always a good caution to test with another kit to verify a result before changing your routine

Sorry, I should have mentioned that....yes, I calibrated the Apex sensor, and I took a sample to the LFS yesterday and they confirmed the Apex numbers with their Salifert kit.  I wouldn't say I'm chasing numbers, as my corals seem to be surviving, just not thriving (except, of course, the GSP, Xenias and kaleidoscope polyps, that seem to grow in any conditions).  My monti caps, zoas, birds nest, favia, acan, etc, all seem to just be "treading water" - so to speak.  I can't imagine having the Ph that low (it bounces between 7.4 and 7.7 over the course of the day) being very ideal, correct?

[Bevo5]

I used the scrubber on my skimmer and it worked pretty well. It becomes a pain to change out the media but it lasted a decent amount of time.  I’ve also dumped a little kalk in my ato. Led to some fluctuations when I’d refill the stop because so much stuff would stir up then get into the tank. Not ideal. 
 

You can get scrubbed up and running in no time. Might as well start there?

[John Vinson]

1 hour ago, Bevo5 said:

I used the scrubber on my skimmer and it worked pretty well. It becomes a pain to change out the media but it lasted a decent amount of time.  I’ve also dumped a little kalk in my ato. Led to some fluctuations when I’d refill the stop because so much stuff would stir up then get into the tank. Not ideal. 
 

You can get scrubbed up and running in no time. Might as well start there?

Do you have your scrubber running 24/7, or did you setup a solenoid or ball valve to a controller?

[Micah]

If you have the option, pull fresh air from outside for your skimmer.  That's helped my pH stay higher than before as well as more stable. 

 

Also, not knocking the advice of the scrubber, because it's super effective, but using outside air or even a recirculating setup is a little safer than using CO2 scrubbing media if you're not super confident in your setup.  If your skimmer has a cup float switch that kills the skimmer, then it's pretty safe, but otherwise I would avoid it.  

[Parzifal]

2 hours ago, John Vinson said:

Sorry, I should have mentioned that....yes, I calibrated the Apex sensor, and I took a sample to the LFS yesterday and they confirmed the Apex numbers with their Salifert kit.  I wouldn't say I'm chasing numbers, as my corals seem to be surviving, just not thriving (except, of course, the GSP, Xenias and kaleidoscope polyps, that seem to grow in any conditions).  My monti caps, zoas, birds nest, favia, acan, etc, all seem to just be "treading water" - so to speak.  I can't imagine having the Ph that low (it bounces between 7.4 and 7.7 over the course of the day) being very ideal, correct?

That makes sense.  Glad to hear it,  I used to chase numbers,  I’d look at the other measurements before looking at equipment.
 

How’s the alkalinity and calcium?

[EMeyer]

Remember that the pH on a natural reef fluctuates from about 7.8 to about 8.1 daily. 

 

I'd focus more on alk. Keep Alk between 7-8, and unless your home has unusually high CO2 pH should stay in a reasonable range. 

[John Vinson]

9 minutes ago, Parzifal said:

That makes sense.  Glad to hear it,  I used to chase numbers,  I’d look at the other measurements before looking at equipment.
 

How’s the alkalinity and calcium?

For what it's worth, the Apex system have been keeping them about where I want them (The doser just keeps adding the min amount, even if the Trident says it's above my desired level of 8.5 (Alk, in this instance)), and even after calibration, the Trident seems to be lower than what Hanna is reporting - which is why I said "for what its worth" LOL.  Calcium is a bit high right now (I turn the doser off if it goes above 530), and same if the Alkalinity is above 8.5. 

 

 

[islandVib3s]

I've always increased my ph naturally as much as possible, cracking open a window and having less company always makes it raise. Having my skimmer run 24/7 increases it also. I've recently started adding kalk to my ato containers but have read alot of good from it. I think high flow helps also but not positive. I also live alone so I don't have alot of traffic or smog in my condo lol all my tanks ph range from 8.3-8.7,when I reach 8.7 I close windows,turn off ceiling fans and skimmer.i think the fresh air plays a huge role for ph.

[pdxmonkeyboy]

I would be absolutely SHOCKED if your ph is 8.7 naturally.  Almost to the point of saying no way. I live next to the forest with minimal traffic so my co2 levels in the air are lower than most. Inner city PDX was like 440 ppm. I am around 330 now. 

Fresh air will likely cure any ph issues.  

[islandVib3s]

1 hour ago, pdxmonkeyboy said:

I would be absolutely SHOCKED if your ph is 8.7 naturally.  Almost to the point of saying no way. I live next to the forest with minimal traffic so my co2 levels in the air are lower than most. Inner city PDX was like 440 ppm. I am around 330 now. 

Fresh air will likely cure any ph issues.  

Well thats what my PH monitor says anyway,I honestly double check it maybe 1x a month with my hanna. Naturally probably isn't the best word to use being that I added everything into a tank lol. But my 40b setup is pretty basic. Diy stand w/no doors and usually skimmer running 24/7,I havent really dosed anything unless I'm not getting the polyp extension im used to,then I add reef fusion1/2 and mag all by hand. I also don't really do waterchanges as much as recommend by most,unless something looks off.i have recently started adding kalk to my ato,about 5ga ago lol.idk I dont chase numbers and hardly test. Also have basic corals and fish,mostly LPS and some easy sps.i really have been slacking on basic maintenance on my tanks. Maybe all the pineapple sponges is helping. Ill double check PH tomorrow 

[SpringFever]

Calcium of 547? am I seeing that correctly? If so that's pretty darn high. That might be a bigger priority than low PH. I run 450 to match my salt and consider that on the high side. 

[John Vinson]

On 12/21/2021 at 12:20 AM, SpringFever said:

Calcium of 547? am I seeing that correctly? If so that's pretty darn high. That might be a bigger priority than low PH. I run 450 to match my salt and consider that on the high side. 

Yeah, I'm still figuring things out with this Trident and the doser.....for some reason it still doses 0.1 mL per hour, even if it's gone over the upper limit that I set (seems this is just how the unit works, my LFS said they just turn the doser off manually and let it settle before turning it back on).  I've started doing the same thing and it's now down to 513

[SuncrestReef]

34 minutes ago, John Vinson said:

Yeah, I'm still figuring things out with this Trident and the doser.....for some reason it still doses 0.1 mL per hour, even if it's gone over the upper limit that I set (seems this is just how the unit works, my LFS said they just turn the doser off manually and let it settle before turning it back on).  I've started doing the same thing and it's now down to 513

The Trident will never completely stop the DOS when the test results are out of range.  It only increases or decreases the dosing up to the percentage you specify, and when outside of the range, it will revert back to the base DOS amount without any adjustments.

You can automate turning off the DOS instead of doing it manually by adding a line of code into the Advanced tab from the DOS Schedule screen:

If Cax3 > 500 Then OFF

It will remain off until the next Trident test result is lower than this value.

Read Neptune’s guide for Trident Controlled Dosing here:

https://www.neptunesystems.com/getstarted/trident/tridentdos/

 

[John Vinson]

41 minutes ago, SuncrestReef said:

The Trident will never completely stop the DOS when the test results are out of range.  It only increases or decreases the dosing up to the percentage you specify, and when outside of the range, it will revert back to the base DOS amount without any adjustments.

You can automate turning off the DOS instead of doing it manually by adding a line of code into the Advanced tab from the DOS Schedule screen:

If Cax3 > 500 Then OFF

It will remain off until the next Trident test result is lower than this value.

Read Neptune’s guide for Trident Controlled Dosing here:

https://www.neptunesystems.com/getstarted/trident/tridentdos/

 

That's exactly what I needed....I added that code in for both Alkalinity and Calcium....many thanks!  (to be clear, I need to set them back to "auto" from "off" in order for the new code to be used, correct?) 

Edited December 22, 2021 by John Vinson

[SuncrestReef]

1 minute ago, John Vinson said:

That's exactly what I needed....I added that code in for both Alkalinity and Calcium....many thanks!  (to be clear, I need to set them back to "auto" from "off" in order for the new code to be used, correct?) 

Yes, leave the DOS dashboard sliders set to AUTO, and the code in the Advanced tab will take care of stopping the DOS when that condition is true.  The slider will still be set to AUTO, but at the upper right of the slider it will say "OFF" instead of "TBL".