TheClark Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Overview As I mentioned a while back, I eagerly sent off some water to Germany for the infamous Triton ICP test. If you are interested in it, there is a great presentation from MACNA here: In a nutshell, a deep analysis is performed on your water at a level never previously available to hobbyists. This data is compared against NSW sampled from around the world and recommendations are made. My Results My Test Results Same Day Using Home Test Kits SG - 1.024 (calibrated refractometer) Calcium - 665 (red sea pro) Alk - 8.624 (Hanna) Mag - 1560 (red sea pro) P04 - 0.00 (Hanna) PH - 8.14 Triton Recommendations Sn (Tin) Too high - 4x15% WC Na (Sodium) too low- Fix salinity Mg (Magnesium) too low- Dose to raise magnesium K -(Potassium) too high - check test kit? Currently not dosing directly Br (Bromine) too high - 4 x 15% WC B (Boron) too low - Dose boron Sr (Strontium) too high - Stop dosing Strontium! Li (Lithium) too high - 4 x 15% WC I (Iodine) too low - Dose iodine Si (Silicone) too high - Check DI and PO4 media Summary One area to note is the personal / home test kits vs the Triton ICP. I was pleasantly surprised at how accurate the Calcium test turned out compared to Red Sea, but felt uneasy that the magnesium test was so far off. I will give these recommendations a try, first documenting coral health and keeping a log of changes. While I am not sure how to dose Boron odds are some googling will yield results. Despite this deep analysis, my salinity, calcium and mag were off. Obviously I have become a bit complacent. These can be adjusted of course without ICP analysis. I am excited to see the results stay tuned... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cor4eyh Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Always been interested in these kinds of systems! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rworegon Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Your pics did not come through. What were the actual levels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Your pics did not come through. What were the actual levels? Hey Randy I just uploaded them via tapatalk, try F5 on the browser... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Googling yielded results on Boron, dosing, etc... Good read here. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/12/chemistry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higher Thinking Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hey man, thanks for sharing. What are we supposed to do about the lithium levels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hey man' date=' thanks for sharing. What are we supposed to do about the lithium levels?[/quote'] It's a hot topic on Reef2Reef. Triton recommends 4x 15% water changes. I am undecided on my course of action right now. Where does it come from I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriz2fer Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 you do understand that your levels will change over the course of the shipping process? by the time they got you sample levels could have been different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 you do understand that your levels will change over the course of the shipping process? by the time they got you sample levels could have been different. How would they change in a sealed container? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earthbound Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 How would they change in a sealed container? I am going with MAGIC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriz2fer Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 For this analysis, samples need to filtered as soon as possible. Particulate phosphorus will be degraded into more PO4, depending on bacteria, sample temperatures, lots of factors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriz2fer Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 I am going with MAGIC how many samples have you sent in? please fill me in on your extensive knowledge on the subject Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 For this analysis' date=' samples need to filtered as soon as possible. Particulate phosphorus will be degraded into more PO4, depending on bacteria, sample temperatures, lots of factors[/quote'] I had the same question at first. Eshan at Triton seems to have his act together. Maybe not, but I am choosing to put some faith in his company and process for now. He does address this very question in the video and the FAQs for what its worth... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badxgillen Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Another nice read from Randy Holmes Farley,Borax mixed with water is so simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Another nice read from Randy Holmes Farley' date='Borax mixed with water is so simple.[/quote'] Isn't that something? The guy sure has had an impact on the hobby.. My first teaspoon went in tonight. Half expected my tank to froth up like a washing machine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenbasketreef Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Thank you Jeremy for sharing the data. How long the process from collecting your sample to receiving the result? I am more concern with the fluctuation in the tank during the course of shipping and receiving the result. Corrective action/s that you do is for past reading of parameters. Some parameters may have change already by the time the result came out and as a result may be over or under correction. One way to address this issue as suggested by Triton is doing more test as often, the drawback is cost prohibitive. It is much better when Triton open up a lab here to reduce the time to get the result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Thank you Jeremy for sharing the data. How long the process from collecting your sample to receiving the result? I am more concern with the fluctuation in the tank during the course of shipping and receiving the result. Corrective action/s that you do is for past reading of parameters. Some parameters may have change already by the time the result came out and as a result may be over or under correction. One way to address this issue as suggested by Triton is doing more test as often, the drawback is cost prohibitive. It is much better when Triton open up a lab here to reduce the time to get the result. Hi Rudy, It is my pleasure to share, seems like an exciting time and new data is available now to learn new things. I ordered the test 13 days ago. Yes, it is quite the moving target, allot can change in 13 days. Having a quicker turn around time would be allot better. Just to keep things under control I dosed nothing other than the usual calcium/alk/vinegar/kalk. No trace elements, nothing at all. The plan is to be conservative with adjustments, then spring for one more test to see if things have been brought into line. Hopefully I do not overshoot given the delay. There was a post by a respected vendor named battlecorals I think. He had three different systems, some did better than others. He sent in three tests just to learn what is different between the systems. Another person was very happy with their tank and corals, but sent off for the test to take a baseline so that if things deteriorate he can have a known good state to get back to. Good stuff happening! Should be interesting to see what/if we learn from this new data. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenbasketreef Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Nice! Yes, I am aware a lot of conversation about Triton test here and in EU. This test bring about a lot of variables that we hope once day able to comprehend and become constant that we can somehow control for the better of our eco system creation. Triton method starting with the test and then additives suppose to not change tank water. Actually I was once finding his website when I was searching for information on LED and he has a really nice dt. I am not sure if the other site already discuss this situation. Most do have water change regularly and the test result still showing some questionable anomaly, I see most received recommendation to do water change for corrective action. For those that already done water change regularly how would the water change will be working for corrective action when actual regular water change already resulted in the anomaly being there in the first place. Changing salt perhaps. We always told by expert to always test and know the level before we add or dose any chemical into our tank, otherwise we blindly treat our tank. This is the reason that Triton suggested to do the test regularly also to know if any corrective action taken place resulted in better reading. In the past we always rely on experience about the result of using certain brand additives, this is why some people do better with certain products. Now with the triton test we'll be able to better understand, hopefully so, and can explain why certain brand or certain equipment is better. Yup too many new variables to comprehend. Now we need the battery industry technology how to neutralize Li Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higher Thinking Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 It's a hot topic on Reef2Reef. Triton recommends 4x 15% water changes. I am undecided on my course of action right now. Where does it come from I wonder? I was thinking the same thing that Rudy posted. Where are things like lithium coming from? If you are doing regular water changes, then doing more water changes isn't going to control that. The salt would be the first guess, but maybe also a byproduct or additive in some of our dosing chemicals. If it was the salt, I wouldn't understand how levels would progressively climb. They would stay rather constant because we pull out equal parts of salt water to how much new salt water we add. That would leave the various additives we are putting into our system as the culprit. Something must have small levels and over time, it consistently builds up. However, maybe it doesn't even matter Here's to hoping for the latter! I am not sure if the other site already discuss this situation. Most do have water change regularly and the test result still showing some questionable anomaly, I see most received recommendation to do water change for corrective action. For those that already done water change regularly how would the water change will be working for corrective action when actual regular water change already resulted in the anomaly being there in the first place. Changing salt perhaps. i Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 I was thinking the same thing that Rudy posted. Where are things like lithium coming from? If you are doing regular water changes, then doing more water changes isn't going to control that. The salt would be the first guess, but maybe also a byproduct or additive in some of our dosing chemicals. If it was the salt, I wouldn't understand how levels would progressively climb. They would stay rather constant because we pull out equal parts of salt water to how much new salt water we add. That would leave the various additives we are putting into our system as the culprit. Something must have small levels and over time, it consistently builds up. However, maybe it doesn't even matter Here's to hoping for the latter! Indeed, I think we are going to see salts contributing to some of this. A quote from Randy on RC 'Lithium seems very high, but some mixes have tested high for lithium in the past. Nothing you can do about it except a water change. ' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandinga Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Those readings are rather hard to translate. Your sodium is considerably low, but your calibrated refractometer reads spot on at 1.024. What to do about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Those readings are rather hard to translate. Your sodium is considerably low, but your calibrated refractometer reads spot on at 1.024. What to do about that? That is a good point. At first it seemed simple, raise the salinity to 1.026. Now one has to wonder if that will be enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandinga Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Another thing that is rather confusing is that they are comparing it to NSW... NSW varies in all of its chemical components as you change from one ocean to another...or from sea to sea...temps range, specific gravity ranges, pH, and so on. It has been proven that NSW is not always a model for how we should keep our tanks, specifically in regards to SG, Ca, and kH. aHHHH Pandora's box is opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 From Eshan @ Triton - Possible cause of tin, sharing because it might be interesting to you all... 2. Tin source in Europe also are often "hose clamps" or other metal-parts close to the Water. The creeping out salt corode them and after the salt faling back the contamination can be quit massive. Another possible cause is bits of solder falling into the tank. DIY LEDs are particularly at risk for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 For those interested in interpreting the results, there is a video on it that answers many (not all!) of the questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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