can a real tide maker work with a good overflow?

[Burningbaal]

So my new inspiration to get a tank going again has me thinking about putting a big tank in after/as we remodel the basement next year. Much planning would need to be done, but it could be in the 150g range for the display, plus a sump with skimmer/macroalgae and possibly slow-flow 'fuge above the display to try to grow some bugs for a mandarin (everyone's dream).

basic idea is this:

• sump (beananimal overflow,) below display with a big macroalgae chamber, possibly a spot for mangroves that I can show via a clear panel in the cabinetry
• slow-flow fuge above the display with a gravity flow into the display, hopefully making this idea for mandarin-food growth  I need to do lots of research here, but probably a small herbie or beananimal that gravity-drains into the display so the little critters make it into the DT alive
• ATO, possibly AWC doing a couple percent change per day (sink is nearby, I could prep a garbage can of saltwater every couple weeks or so). maybe use some of the 'out' water for a frag/QT tank if I get that into it
• The other one is where it gets weird. I love the idea of a real wavemaker box. I'm talking something like 10-20% of the DT volume up high in a tank above the DT with a giant pump that can fill that whole tank in a few minute's time. Put one giant (like 3") bulkhead near the top of the wave tank with a downpipe that goes nearly to the bottom of the wave tank, probably with an airlifter to break the airlock. Maybe add an emergency overflow bulkhead, but that's it. This way, the siphon in the wave tank doesn't start until all 20-30g of the tank is full (to the bulkhead), but it will keep draining until the wave tank is basically emptying. with a big bulkhead, this should happen very fast, making what would seem to be a true wave in a tide pool. the siphon breaks, the pump fills it back up in a few minutes and the process repeats. one caveat:  this is not quiet.

But here's the problem. that tide cycle makes the water level really variable in the DT. this is totally the point/on purpose, but it seems like that would be havoc for the normal overflow to the DT...any thoughts?

[SuncrestReef]

With a fixed-position overflow in the DT, I think your idea would cause more of a water level fluctuation in the sump than in the DT as the return pump evacuated water to refill the DT, but no water is draining into the sump to replace it while your wavemaker box fills.  This would then trigger the ATO to add fresh water.

It seems you’d need some way to have a moveable overflow pipe that works in conjunction with the wavemaker.  Seems pretty complicated.

[xmas_one]

No

[Higher Thinking]

To your last point, check out Borneman or Carlson Surge Device. There are certainly a lot of drawbacks, but feel free to take a swing at it!

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[SuncrestReef]

21 hours ago, SuncrestReef said:

With a fixed-position overflow in the DT, I think your idea would cause more of a water level fluctuation in the sump than in the DT as the return pump evacuated water to refill the DT, but no water is draining into the sump to replace it while your wavemaker box fills.  This would then trigger the ATO to add fresh water.

It seems you’d need some way to have a moveable overflow pipe that works in conjunction with the wavemaker.  Seems pretty complicated.

After more thought, I realized that you could easily overcome the water level fluctuation messing with the ATO if it's controlled by an Apex or other controller.  You could program it so every hour the wavemaker pump is shut down for about 10 minutes.  During this time the water level will be stable and the ATO can then refill any evaporated water.  Then the controller turns off the ATO and resumes running the wavemaker, so the two systems just run on opposite schedules with no conflict.

[Burningbaal]

21 hours ago, SuncrestReef said:

This would then trigger the ATO to add fresh water.

I saw one person point out that you could put your ATO trigger at the low point. I think you're right the return section in the sump would be pretty dynamic. I could put the ATO trigger at the lowest point in the surge's cycle (when the surge is about to start flowing into the DT) and that might work as long as the ATO could respond quickly (the return is about to start filling again, which will turn off the ATO, so it would probably have very short cycles).

@Higher Thinking, that's an interesting alternative for the surge; using the toilet tank setup...clever and simple.

 

I think what I might do is to build the fuge (above the DT) with a modified bean animal where the open pipe (or emergency) is oversized and with a threaded end fitting so I can screw on a downpipe. That way I can make the fuge into a small surge tank whenever I feel like it just by screwing on the downpipe. the normal 'siphon' would only siphon for a brief moment at the top of the surge, then the one with the downpipe would hold the siphon until it breaks. in a 20g fuge I could get 10g of siphon without too much trouble.

The key on this is the variable water level in the return of the sump. if I'm being honest, I'm thinking I'll set it up so I can add that downpipe to the fuge, but probably won't actually use it except for the occassional dog-and-pony show when showing off the tank. then I can put it back and not worry about the ATO issues.

[pdxmonkeyboy]

I think it would be a cool idea.  In the meantime we can think of things to name it...because we all know that 50% of the aquarium coolness factor is the names.  

 

Off the top of my head...

"the carpet soaker"  

"salt creep 1000"  

[pdxmonkeyboy]

I would be sure to have a pretty big overflow box that the bean is in.  It will take some time for the siphon to reestablish after each successive draining and dumping cycle.