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SPS problems


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Ok so I have come across some recent SPS problems and can't get to the bottom of it. I am getting weekly sometimes more STN of my acros. The corals are receding from the bottom up. About 1/2 of the remaining SPS are really lacking polyp extension and pale in color. 

Tank stats 200 gallon with 40 gallon sump, running a Deltec slimmer, Geo calcium reactor, Apex, ATI 8 bulb fixture with OR 247 supplemental lighting, changes socks once per week and feed heavy, I have a large amount if cheato on timed light cycle that grows well

i have 16 fish in the tank ranging from small to big, feed LRS, formula one pellets, spiraling brine and mysis shrimp along with Nori. I rotate through these foods but feed twice a day.

My light cycle is leds on from 1-9 and t5 on from 2-8

todays numbers:

alk 8.6, CA 395, MAG 1390, PO4 .10, NO3 ZERO, SALINITY 1.025 TEMP 78.2

No alk swings and no bugs. I pulled all my mp-40 and checked for rusty magnets and for any exposed wires in sump. I also for good measure added a stray voltage probe. 

The one noticeable thing I am questioning is TDS. can tds lead to stn/Rtn? I use a spectra pure 6 stage unit that goes directly to my tank on a float valve. I checked all the RO/DI numbers today and are as follows. Into membrane 9, out of membrane 11, into DI 7, out of DI 4.  I FLUSHED THE MEMBRANE FOR ABOUT 5 MIN PRIOR TO CHECKING NUMBERS. 

could it be as simple as TDS? Or the lack of nitrates?  I've been adding stump remover to bring nitrates up and when I stay with it things polyp out a lil better, but depletes quickly.

 

Any thoughts or ideas would be great.

 

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Hey Brian sorry to hear you are having problems. One question I had was whether or no those TDS numbers were consistent with what you were seeing previously. On my system I would typically see 1-2 out of the RO and zero out of the DI but obviously a different water supply. I think more important than the absolute number would be a change from previous readings that might suggest a degradation in the quality. 

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Just to add to that, I know that several folk on here have had SPS related issues in the recent past.  At least one of those came back to water supply problems in combination with a partially depleted DI resin but that was in PDX during the time they were messing with their source water - which clearly wouldn't affected you.  Ended up with them adding ammonia to the tank via their RO/DI.  Just makes me suspicious now... They mostly suffered from bleaching however.

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39 minutes ago, CuttleFishandCoral said:

Brian your membrane is shot or maybe not hooked up properly. The tds should drop after it goes threw the membrane. On a good ro system it should drop tds to 1 or 0 after the membrane and then the di should finish it to 0. 

Good to know what I have seen is similar to others.  Honestly wasn't sure how reliable/accurate these TDS readers are in the field.

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I have been reading a ton on recession from the base as two of my new colonies are currently afflicted. 

It seems most people point to either alk swings or low nitrogen/high phos.  If you are seeing cyano then i think that is a huge indicator of the nutrient imbalance being the problem. 

I dipped my affected colonies in coral RX.  Dont know if it will help but it certainly couldnt hurt. 

Keep us posted!!

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Ok so update.....i have ordered all new membranes, pre filters and di for RO/DI unit. Also ordered a Triton test to ease the mind and contacted my local water company to see if anything has changed or been added/subtracted from water in past six months. I was told nothing has changed in over 1.5 years.  

Sooooooo..i am leaning at this point to a couple  culprits  one being water quality and two being nutrients or lack there of

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On 7/26/2017 at 8:08 PM, River City Corals said:

Sooooooo..i am leaning at this point to a couple  culprits  one being water quality and two being nutrients or lack there of

I hope you have found your answer. 

It is fairly odd though to have lack of nutrients and cyano in the same system IME. It can happen, but not to often. 16 fish being fed one of 5 foods 2 times a day and the cheato is growing also does not sound like much of an environment of a nutrient poor system. 

Typically IME cheato growth shows that there is ample nutrients in a system. It is when it changes colors to either much darker or much lighter (lime/yellow) that is indicative of a nutrient poor system. 

What part of the day are you taking your nitrate reading? If your feeding twice a day it could fluctuate throughout the day with great filtration. 

If your feeding 2x a day though, and feeding heavy like you stated, even with great filtration a 0 for nitrate would be unique. I might take in water sample next time you visit the LFS and ask them to run that for you. 

The only times I have ever seen cyano with a 0 nitrate in my system is when I was figuring out a carbon dosing level threshold. I have never had 0 nitrate and been able to keep cheato alive and growing myself. 

JME, hope that helps you. 

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7 minutes ago, pledosophy said:

I hope you have found your answer. 

It is fairly odd though to have lack of nutrients and cyano in the same system IME. It can happen, but not to often. 16 fish being fed one of 5 foods 2 times a day and the cheato is growing also does not sound like much of an environment of a nutrient poor system. 

Typically IME cheato growth shows that there is ample nutrients in a system. It is when it changes colors to either much darker or much lighter (lime/yellow) that is indicative of a nutrient poor system. 

What part of the day are you taking your nitrate reading? If your feeding twice a day it could fluctuate throughout the day with great filtration. 

If your feeding 2x a day though, and feeding heavy like you stated, even with great filtration a 0 for nitrate would be unique. I might take in water sample next time you visit the LFS and ask them to run that for you. 

The only times I have ever seen cyano with a 0 nitrate in my system is when I was figuring out a carbon dosing level threshold. I have never had 0 nitrate and been able to keep cheato alive and growing myself. 

JME, hope that helps you. 

So in resding up whatvi have discovered is the redfield ratio imbalance between po4 and no3 is likely what is causing the cyano.

i should state i "try" to feed 2 times a day but on work days they typically only feed once

i have noticed prior to this new dilemma that corals colors were good, good PE but very luttle growth. They were growing justnot at rates i am used too.  I feel like my alk consimption was extremely low for the sheer number of SPS FRAGS, mini colonies and colonies i had in the tank. I run a carbon doser regulator and have it set at very low smountvof co2  1 bubble per 10 seconds and drip rate is about 1.5 drips per second

when i started reafing sbout the issue i believe im dealing with, starving corals. I started looking into dosing nitrates. I did get to a point where i saw a change in nitrates from 0-15 but was surprised when it was underctabe the nextday. Apparently you need to find your daily consumption and continue dosing as it depletes daily in a starving environment

coupled with 0 nitrates. My alk was on high side snd am told it needs to be much closer to seawater in the 7's

so what has been done:

odered all new RO/DI replacement membranes. Pre fikters snd DI resin. Naturally lowering alk by shutting off reactor, dosing nitrates to find daily consumption and removed cheato as i think it is robbing the nutrients 

thoughts?

i will start do frequent water changes when filters arrive tomorrow

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