Frank Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Although most of you have seen my growth shot... I wanted to share this. Pretty exciting! (rock2) I'm running the reefstar LED's and the one thing I hear is the same question: Are (1) watt LED's or three watt LED's better?(scratch) Well not really sure on the proper answer. I just know how my tank is doing with only having the (1) watt LED's. (clap) The tank is (30) tall and the lights are off the water (15) inches. Below are pictures of surprising growth achieved....which shows that (1) watt LED's can penetrate (30) tall no problem! Not to mention grow SPS corals amazingly well. 3/7/12 10/12 3/12 7/12 10/12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peligro Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Now that's with just the leds running, or with your combo T5's to HTC EVO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Posted October 14, 2012 Author Share Posted October 14, 2012 LED's and T5 but this is in front of the tank my T5 are set up 2 then LED then 4 the LED and then 2 more. and a the bottom of the tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peligro Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 So can you say which is providing the most growth HTC EVO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Posted October 15, 2012 Author Share Posted October 15, 2012 To me with out a doubt the LED's. Don't think 8 T5's on 4ft deep wont cover plus not really sure the T5's with do 40 tall, They are more to the get the color right where I want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arminius Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 So, you're running LED supplemented by T5's? I am not questioning growth or color, your animals look very healthy and all have new growth indicators. I am asking more from an experimental control point of view...ohhhh...300g cube - I just saw that...mind blowing is what I chimed in to say....never mind the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I would like to preface this by saying I am in no way belittling the growth or the awesomeness of your tank but I would like to play devils advocate. Everything I have ever read and been told by many led experts is that 1 watt led's are for color only and have little par value. When I bought my current fixture I was told by many people on other forums to remove the 1 watt led's and upgrade to 3 watt led's because the 1 watt's were no more than moon lights. A couple of questions: Could it be that if you have enough led's, even 1 watt led's you will get enough par value to be all you need for a reef? Wouldn't a better experiment be to run only the led's for a period of time to truly be able to tell if they are growing your corals? I think with the right water chemistry it is not inconceivable that 8 t5 bulbs could give you that growth. I have seen your tank and it is amazing so I would really like some experts to chime in here because it seems there is some mixed information out there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoobtoSalt Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I would like to preface this by saying I am in no way belittling the growth or the awesomeness of your tank but I would like to play devils advocate. Everything I have ever read and been told by many led experts is that 1 watt led's are for color only and have little par value. When I bought my current fixture I was told by many people on other forums to remove the 1 watt led's and upgrade to 3 watt led's because the 1 watt's were no more than moon lights. A couple of questions: Could it be that if you have enough led's, even 1 watt led's you will get enough par value to be all you need for a reef? Wouldn't a better experiment be to run only the led's for a period of time to truly be able to tell if they are growing your corals? I think with the right water chemistry it is not inconceivable that 8 t5 bulbs could give you that growth. I have seen your tank and it is amazing so I would really like some experts to chime in here because it seems there is some mixed information out there. Even with my 3 watt leds with the drivers turned halfway down as well as the reef keeper set about halfway I'm only running them at around 1 watt each. That being said the lights are much closer to the water then any of Franks so it's not the same comparison. Before my tank crashed i had great growth in my sps. Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Flenderson Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 This should be interesting. I have the same green coral as in the first picture in my tank. Kicking my self I can't remember the name. It is also I believe a very similar size. I'm running a mix of the 3 watt blues and 5 watt whites. Curious to see how my growth stacks up in 6 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Posted October 15, 2012 Author Share Posted October 15, 2012 I would like to preface this by saying I am in no way belittling the growth or the awesomeness of your tank but I would like to play devils advocate. Everything I have ever read and been told by many led experts is that 1 watt led's are for color only and have little par value. When I bought my current fixture I was told by many people on other forums to remove the 1 watt led's and upgrade to 3 watt led's because the 1 watt's were no more than moon lights. A couple of questions: Could it be that if you have enough led's, even 1 watt led's you will get enough par value to be all you need for a reef? Wouldn't a better experiment be to run only the led's for a period of time to truly be able to tell if they are growing your corals? I think with the right water chemistry it is not inconceivable that 8 t5 bulbs could give you that growth. I have seen your tank and it is amazing so I would really like some experts to chime in here because it seems there is some mixed information out there. Most three watt LED's only have a Med quantity there are a 120 watts of the one watts. Even if 8 T5's would work on 48 deep dont think they would grow at 30 deep and 15 off the water. I have had SPS get snapped off and seen them grow from the ground up. I would have to strongly disagree that one watts are just little more than moon lights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peligro Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I would as well, I greatly defended the led fixture you purchaced because I'm.100% wanting it after talking to ken. What his theory is makes a lot of sense, and after looking at a lot of fixtures I see flaws and the idea of the reefstar led fixture looks and sounds great. Although I'm no expert and say this imo. And frank your coral look amazing, and with the planning and equipment you have put into your tank. I'll take your word on it HTC EVO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I would as well, I greatly defended the led fixture you purchaced because I'm.100% wanting it after talking to ken. What his theory is makes a lot of sense, and after looking at a lot of fixtures I see flaws and the idea of the reefstar led fixture looks and sounds great. Although I'm no expert and say this imo. And frank your coral look amazing, and with the planning and equipment you have put into your tank. I'll take your word on it HTC EVO What are his ideas? I am actually very curious about this subject as I have always seen this discussion go towards 3 watt or higher led's being the way to go. I have considered going strictly to led's but I like t-5's and am kinda stubborn. Fixtures with 1 watt led's are much cheaper but I am assuming the way Kenny's are powered has something to do with them having a better success rate than others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuttleFishandCoral Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I think it has a lot to do with the optics not just the watts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Flenderson Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I think it has a lot to do with the optics not just the watts. What optics do the reefstars run? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefnjunkie Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 What optics do the reefstars run? If I'm not mistaken the 1st gen ran without optics. I am running 100% LED with mainly Carclo's ripple wide optics but my LEDs are only running at about 60-70% so ~ 2 watts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeramy Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I have been running just reef star lights on my tanks sense last april and have been experiencing some great growth. I will post some growth comparison pictures in two months on my new 90 system that has only one watt reefstar lights =) I am using an older 1st generation 119 watt that I added the optics to, and two of the par 56 bulbs that come with optics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefboy Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I will get pics of my display have been running kens lights almost a year they have no optics( I like the spread better and no spot light affect) and are almost a foot above the tank I get good growth from top to bottom and will be upgrading all lights I can eventually on my system but proof is in the pics and beings I figured out how to use my white balance on my cam I might get a good tank shot know lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderBlue Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Not to railroad this thread but I can't find a price in his stuff? Website isn't up yet..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefboy Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Not to railroad this thread but I can't find a price in his stuff? Website isn't up yet..? i would pm kenny direct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelsz3 Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Not to railroad this thread but I can't find a price in his stuff? Website isn't up yet..? http://www.pnwmas.org/forums/showthread.php?32039-NEW-LED-LIGHTS!! look under sponser forum idk if prices are current Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReefStar Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Been busy with the family and working on the new tank!(clap)(clap) I just saw this thread so I thought I would chime in. I would like to preface this by saying I am in no way belittling the growth or the awesomeness of your tank but I would like to play devils advocate. Everything I have ever read and been told by many led experts is that 1 watt led's are for color only and have little par value. When I bought my current fixture I was told by many people on other forums to remove the 1 watt led's and upgrade to 3 watt led's because the 1 watt's were no more than moon lights. A couple of questions: Could it be that if you have enough led's, even 1 watt led's you will get enough par value to be all you need for a reef? Wouldn't a better experiment be to run only the led's for a period of time to truly be able to tell if they are growing your corals? I think with the right water chemistry it is not inconceivable that 8 t5 bulbs could give you that growth. I have seen your tank and it is amazing so I would really like some experts to chime in here because it seems there is some mixed information out there. If you want to see just Reefstar led only growth; look at frankb's tank. He can attest the growth on led only. What are his ideas? I am actually very curious about this subject as I have always seen this discussion go towards 3 watt or higher led's being the way to go. I have considered going strictly to led's but I like t-5's and am kinda stubborn. Fixtures with 1 watt led's are much cheaper but I am assuming the way Kenny's are powered has something to do with them having a better success rate than others? Actually 1w cost more to manufacturer than 3w. Comparing 1w and 3w with the same wattage, it cost less to make a 3w unit. 1w and 3w cost almost the same per led. For example 120w light; 1w=120 leds, 3w= 40 leds. It would cost more for labor cost on the 1w because it has more leds to put together. That is why a lot of manufacturer moved to the 3w leds; by moving to less leds per unit will sacrafice the the color blending. That is why you see color separation on rocks and sand. My theory for using 1w: 1- Comparing same wattage unit, there are more led per sq inch on the 1w than the 3w units. 1w: 120 leds, 3w: 40 leds, 3x as much leds on the 1w! The more leds per sq inch; you get better color blending, better and even par number throughout the tank, more lighting surface. For example AI sol. 3w x 24 leds= 72 total watts. With only 24 leds for one unit, it has to be placed further apart. That is why you see the color separation on rocks and sand. Also you need more units to cover a tank. Check the par on the AI sol. Yes it has high par right under the 3w led, but if you go over a little bit in any directions; the par drops. With the leds place too far apart, you don't get even par throughout the tank. Most tank that is running 3w leds are only running at 50-70% anyways. 2- As for par. Check out the you tube clip I did at the beginning of my development par testing on my prototype unit. Most sps will survive about 240 par. I was getting 320 par at the sand bed. About 2000 at water surface, 1200 at 12". Remember this is a 24" deep tank. 3- The spectrum graph of the Reefstar led is almost the like the spectrum graph of the 400w Radium 20k. I copied the spectrum of the 400w radium 20k is because I like the color and growth. There is a led discussion thread on this forum I post both graph. I can go on and on, but if anyone that has any questions on leds; I am more than happy to chat!(clap) Pm me or give me a call. 503-998-6999- Kenny Anyone that are interested the the 3w units, I can make one for you. What optics do the reefstars run? I use a variety of optics degree to get the optimal spread and par. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Been busy with the family and working on the new tank!(clap)(clap) I just saw this thread so I thought I would chime in. If you want to see just Reefstar led only growth; look at frankb's tank. He can attest the growth on led only. Actually 1w cost more to manufacturer than 3w. Comparing 1w and 3w with the same wattage, it cost less to make a 3w unit. 1w and 3w cost almost the same per led. For example 120w light; 1w=120 leds, 3w= 40 leds. It would cost more for labor cost on the 1w because it has more leds to put together. That is why a lot of manufacturer moved to the 3w leds; by moving to less leds per unit will sacrafice the the color blending. That is why you see color separation on rocks and sand. My theory for using 1w: 1- Comparing same wattage unit, there are more led per sq inch on the 1w than the 3w units. 1w: 120 leds, 3w: 40 leds, 3x as much leds on the 1w! The more leds per sq inch; you get better color blending, better and even par number throughout the tank, more lighting surface. For example AI sol. 3w x 24 leds= 72 total watts. With only 24 leds for one unit, it has to be placed further apart. That is why you see the color separation on rocks and sand. Also you need more units to cover a tank. Check the par on the AI sol. Yes it has high par right under the 3w led, but if you go over a little bit in any directions; the par drops. With the leds place too far apart, you don't get even par throughout the tank. Most tank that is running 3w leds are only running at 50-70% anyways. 2- As for par. Check out the you tube clip I did at the beginning of my development par testing on my prototype unit. Most sps will survive about 240 par. I was getting 320 par at the sand bed. About 2000 at water surface, 1200 at 12". Remember this is a 24" deep tank. 3- The spectrum graph of the Reefstar led is almost the like the spectrum graph of the 400w Radium 20k. I copied the spectrum of the 400w radium 20k is because I like the color and growth. There is a led discussion thread on this forum I post both graph. I can go on and on, but if anyone that has any questions on leds; I am more than happy to chat!(clap) Pm me or give me a call. 503-998-6999- Kenny Anyone that are interested the the 3w units, I can make one for you. I use a variety of optics degree to get the optimal spread and par. Thank you. This is exactly the info I was looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderBlue Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Very good info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefboy Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 heres a few shots and my tanks shot skills still lacking but I think you will get the idea these all under reefstar LED 1 watt and these have no optics pick this frag up from the junkie a couple months ago so he can atest to its growth:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefnjunkie Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Thats awesome growth on the lemonade- that thing encrusted a 4" circle of rock before it did any vertical growth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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