WAVES Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 If you have to run a ball valve the way to do it is to T off the line and run a return to the sump that has the ball valve on it. That way any excess water is being pumped back into the sump and you are not putting back pressure on your pump. If this is a closed loop that can put you in a situation with alot of water on your floor, it will also add alot more possibilty of micro bubbles pushing that much water through the sump, unless its huge as stated. Also, Sequence pumps can be throttled back with a ball valve with no adverse effects whats so ever. In fact they will use less energy and may even last longer. WHen you put the pressure on them (you must put it on the output, not imput) the impeller simply spins in place without moving as much water, this means its working less hard because there is actually less resistance, hence less power consumption. Sequence now advertises on there Dart boxes "flow from 400-3600gph". You can also effectivly reduce flow by reducing the pipe size, go down to 1" instead of 1.5" on the output, again, just be sure the output is smaller than the imput or the pump will cavitate. The problem I see is if you feel the pump is way over rated (I dont feel it is) it will be alot more noisy, bigger, and possibly hotter than running a Dart. I am putting 2 darts on my 150gal at home becuase they are so quiet and use little power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly guy Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 If this is a closed loop that can put you in a situation with alot of water on your floor, it will also add alot more possibilty of micro bubbles pushing that much water through the sump, unless its huge as stated. . i didnt know that about the throttling back as being "ok"...good to know but the closed loop should have nothing to do with the sump.......... cls pump infeed(s) -> pump -> OM unit-> cls returns sump should never see the water in the closed loop part of the system......thats what makes it a "closed" loop reefgeek......i will also offer this.....if you go to use a bunch of flex pipe in plumbing this OM unit........take your time and there are a few tricks that if you dont do you WILL have bubbles in your cls returns elevate the pump somehow and put a full time fan on it to help with heat issues............ I just use a block of boat plastic to get it up in the air a few inches... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 If this is a closed loop that can put you in a situation with alot of water on your floor, it will also add alot more possibilty of micro bubbles pushing that much water through the sump, unless its huge as stated. Also, Sequence pumps can be throttled back with a ball valve with no adverse effects whats so ever. In fact they will use less energy and may even last longer. WHen you put the pressure on them (you must put it on the output, not imput) the impeller simply spins in place without moving as much water, this means its working less hard because there is actually less resistance, hence less power consumption. Sequence now advertises on there Dart boxes "flow from 400-3600gph". You can also effectivly reduce flow by reducing the pipe size, go down to 1" instead of 1.5" on the output, again, just be sure the output is smaller than the imput or the pump will cavitate. The problem I see is if you feel the pump is way over rated (I dont feel it is) it will be alot more noisy, bigger, and possibly hotter than running a Dart. I am putting 2 darts on my 150gal at home becuase they are so quiet and use little power. Thank you for that info. Joel...It will be a closed loop...not alot of flow is going to come from sump. Yeah, I am worried about niose, but I am considering getting some of that rigid foam from HD and lining the inside of the cabinet with that in hopes to quiet it down...I am also worried about heat transfer to the tank with this pump... I will put a ball valve on the output side for sure so if need be I can throttle it back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 If this is a closed loop that can put you in a situation with alot of water on your floor, it will also add alot more possibilty of micro bubbles pushing that much water through the sump, unless its huge as stated. Also, Sequence pumps can be throttled back with a ball valve with no adverse effects whats so ever. In fact they will use less energy and may even last longer. WHen you put the pressure on them (you must put it on the output, not imput) the impeller simply spins in place without moving as much water, this means its working less hard because there is actually less resistance, hence less power consumption. Sequence now advertises on there Dart boxes "flow from 400-3600gph". You can also effectivly reduce flow by reducing the pipe size, go down to 1" instead of 1.5" on the output, again, just be sure the output is smaller than the imput or the pump will cavitate. The problem I see is if you feel the pump is way over rated (I dont feel it is) it will be alot more noisy, bigger, and possibly hotter than running a Dart. I am putting 2 darts on my 150gal at home becuase they are so quiet and use little power. I just confirmed the throttling back of the pump, the sequence site says my pump is rated at 200-700gph, which gives me a good indication that it can be throttled back with no problem...so thanks Joel... I am very worried about noise and heat transfer at this point...so we will see...(scary) (scary) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R-3 Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 One thing you need to remember geek is that the two guys that posted on RC about not sand bed issues are not running a big pump likes yours. They are running Seios and Tunze. Which honestly when I had my 75 setup I had two 1100's, 2 MJ 1200's and my return which wa about 1000 for a grand total of approxiamtely 3600GPH. There is no way my tank had that much flow. The flow from those SEIO are a lot different than the flow that you are going to incure from a straight source. Keep that in mind. I dont knoe do what ya wanna do. I just think that pump if very oversized. A big pump like that is gonna make a lot of heat too i would think.Later Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 One thing you need to remember geek is that the two guys that posted on RC about not sand bed issues are not running a big pump likes yours. They are running Seios and Tunze. Which honestly when I had my 75 setup I had two 1100's' date=' 2 MJ 1200's and my return which wa about 1000 for a grand total of approxiamtely 3600GPH. There is no way my tank had that much flow. The flow from those SEIO are a lot different than the flow that you are going to incure from a straight source. Keep that in mind. I dont knoe do what ya wanna do. I just think that pump if very oversized. A big pump like that is gonna make a lot of heat too i would think.Later Ryan[/quote'] yeah, the heat is what I am worried about as well...I posted asking about it, so we will see... I may try to sell this and just get a dart like Joel was talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyles Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 the sequence site says my pump is rated at 200-700gph what happened to 6000 gph? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 what happened to 6000 gph? Sorry I forgot a zero.... 2000-7000gph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nu2reef-n Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 I thought it was 7800 gph @ 0'? Are we talking about a different pump now, did I miss something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyles Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 I would throw it on craigslist.org as a pond/aquarium pump and see what happens, its going off season now but who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly guy Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 FWIW, that Dart is the quietest pump ive ever seen. My cat purrs way louder than it does....im not kidding. And i havent noticed it heat the water much. My Barracuda doesnt heat the water much either but like i said before....i have a fan on it 24/7. Its not nearly as quiet........but not bad either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 I thought it was 7800 gph @ 0'? Are we talking about a different pump now' date=' did I miss something?[/quote'] no it is 7400 @ 0'... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 Since I have everyone on board helping me with this...Thank you...also if this is to big then what size pump should I be looking at? I just want one pump on the Closed loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R-3 Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Any of the Reeflo Sequence pumps. I would say the dart personally. I know that Randy runs a dart and a barracuda and says he likes the Dart better. The Dart will be my next closed loop pump on a big tank. Ohh yeah I said it next big tank! MOOHHAHAHHA! Later Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sknoch78 Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 I have a dart for my return pump and I can say it is the quietest most efficient pump I have ever used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 Any of the Reeflo Sequence pumps. I would say the dart personally. I know that Randy runs a dart and a barracuda and says he likes the Dart better. The Dart will be my next closed loop pump on a big tank. Ohh yeah I said it next big tank! MOOHHAHAHHA! Later Ryan I think the dart might be on the small side... It is only 2820@4', I have a gen x on my tank now, that is rated at 1190@0' feet and it is on a 50gal and there is flow but not a ton, so doubling the tank size and getting a pump that is double that, I do not think it will be a ton of flow...but maybe that is me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly guy Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 I run a dart on the 90 bb sps tank and a barracuda on the 225 dsb lps/softy tank, both with OM 8 ways. I think the dart would be a great pump for your mixed reef, and like i already emphasized before, IMO pay the extra 100 bucks for the 8-way.......I guarantee you wont regret it if you plan on running spraybars. To be sure you understand the "why" of this, it isnt becasue you cant split the 4 way out and get just as many returns....... its because you cant get a drum cut with 3 ports open, one every 120 degrees, so that your spray bars are never taking more than 1/3 of your total closed loop flow. hth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 I run a dart on the 90 bb sps tank and a barracuda on the 225 dsb lps/softy tank. I think the dart would be a great pump for your mixed reef, and like i already emphasized before, IMO pay the extra 100 bucks for the 8-way.......I guarantee you wont regret it if you plan on running spraybars. To be sure you understand the "why" of this, it isnt becasue you cant split the 4 way out and get just as many returns....... its because you cant get a drum cut with 3 ports open, one every 120 degrees, so that your spray bars are never taking more than 1/3 of your total closed loop flow. hth I was just thinking of the spray bar for toning the flow down is all...So if I am not going to tone the flow down I do not think I will go with a spray bar. I am just worried that the dart is going to be to small...my tank is going to be mostly SPS...there are only a few LPS that I want in the tank and those I can place where flow would be minimal to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyles Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 what is your plan if you run a dart? what are you going to do with the flow? I run the dart on my spraybar and locline to hydor flo's (8 of them) and another 1000 gph from the sump. It depends on how you use the flow, what are you going to do? A CLS, OM, or? I think the dart will be fine in a 48 x 24, after all its what I use on a 72 x 24, I have a few places that could do with a little more flow but all my SPS are happy all over the top. But I cheat a little with the hydor flo's. When I do my next tank it will probably be OM with about 25% more flow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 what is your plan if you run a dart? what are you going to do with the flow? I run the dart on my spraybar and locline to hydor flo's (8 of them) and another 1000 gph from the sump. It depends on how you use the flow' date=' what are you going to do? A CLS, OM, or? I think the dart will be fine in a 48 x 24, after all its what I use on a 72 x 24, I have a few places that could do with a little more flow but all my SPS are happy all over the top. But I cheat a little with the hydor flo's. When I do my next tank it will probably be OM with about 25% more flow.[/quote'] I plan on an OM 4-way, if I drop down pumps I am going to just run the 4 ports...My Closed loop is going to be the extent of water movement, as I am going to run a gravity feed skimmer and figure only about 300-450gph coming from the sump, so not much there at all.... I talked with Paul at OM and he should me this He says this is the best way to set up a 4-way in a tank...The top pieces coming pointing down are from the sump... The reason he says to go this route, is because the way the bottom four are positioned they will force the water up and into the overflow of the tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 Here is someone's tank that is running this set up and this is what the water aggetation looks like... OFF (the fronts ones, this is with the back ones going)---- ON---- under the water OFF(the fronts ones, this is with the back ones going)-------- ON---- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAVES Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 I would use 2 darts to get 7400gph rather than one whatever you have. Is it a barracuda or 6000 series? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted August 31, 2006 Author Share Posted August 31, 2006 I would use 2 darts to get 7400gph rather than one whatever you have. Is it a barracuda or 6000 series? it is the power series...I do not want to run two CL's I only have one OM and do not want to spend the money on the other, this is why I am not sure if I should go with a Dart.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCR Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Well this has been an interesting thread. I would like to see a video camera setup, before you turn it on for the 1st time. Just for the record. It seems this thread is split in opinions. It's at the point now, when your done, That your either going to suceed (and really, no one wants a disaster) or your gona need a lot of rags, and a huge shop vac, and possibly a net for flying fish!!!. But really, with 5 pages here. Why not document, either way, we will all learn from it. Good Luck. I will be starting a 210 soon, and I want to approch it compleatly differently from my others. So I am interested in the results. Again Good Luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAVES Posted September 1, 2006 Share Posted September 1, 2006 If this is a closed loop that can put you in a situation with alot of water on your floor' date=' it will also add alot more possibilty of micro bubbles pushing that much water through the sump, unless its huge as stated. [/quote'] I realized later this sounded really rude. Sorry if I offended you Sean, I by no means want it to look like Im attacking you. again, my apologies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.