reefgeek84

I agree 100%...If everyone could steal and get away with it, alot more people would be stealing...but the fear of not knowing if security is watching either on cameras or undercover, detours alot of people from doing it...Same thing here, if more people were armed and responsible about it, I think alot of people would think twice before they do this sort of thing. Again I do not think that more are guns are the complete answer, I think education is another major factor in it.

I completely resent the fact that you are up on your ivory tower, telling me "guns really do kill people" step off your high horse and down from that tower...sorry that is it for the personal shot, but that is ridiculous. I am sorry for your loses...I have known two people to be shot and killed, so I do have a feeling of what it feels like...They were not family members so I do not know it on that degree... That is the wrong mentality...I never said it was about winning a fight...I said I am not sure if I feel safer with a gun or not, but it is stories like this that make me consider it. as for parents leaving guns around the house and kids playing with them, I truly feel that is a lack of parenting not a childs fault..so that is an issue that needs to be addressed as parents are not being responsible for teaching their children to respect a gun and their fault for leaving a loaded gun around the house where their kids can access it...not the guns fault. I would have never in a million years just picked up a gun to play with it, because I was taught that is not what you do... You seem to blame guns for people doing things with them...that makes no sense to me...should we out law knives cause people kill people with them. Maybe we should out law cars, because there are stupid people behind the wheel and they kill people? You take everything I say and put your own thought on it...I never said I look up to these people, so that it is your own imaginations concoction. I said that they are examples of how it should be and I believe how most people are. I like alot of people's fish tanks and think they are good examples of tanks, but I do not look up to them... I do believe that everyone needs to be taught about gun safety... like driving, there is a reason we do not have anything like the autobahn here in the states...because we do not respect driving, we are merely taught to pass a test. Imagine people knowing their limits and their car's limits and driving a on a road that has no speed limit...man a crazy thought. Speaking of this, I was watching a thing on HD (cause I love my HD) it was about drifting and one of the guys is from Sweden and he teaches kids about cars and different things that can happen driving, lets them get a little swirly to show them how it feels and how quickly it can get out of control. He said he does this because in the states we are merely taught to pass a test, but are not taught to respect the roads and cars that we drive and others are driving. In more danger with it or with out...that is all subjective...I know many people who have needed to draw gun and it 99.9% saved their life! I digress however...You have said your peace and I have said mine...one of those things were I do not think we will convince each other wise...I think you have brought up very valid points and made me sit and think some, which is why I love this sort of dialog and I started this thread. Would love to hear what others think.

Because I know what it takes to get a CWP and I know the people who have them...they are trained like cops...trust me, 99.9% of people who have a CWP, would not just start shooting randomly and from afar...that I know for sure. I guess my thinking is if these people have no idea who is carrying them and they open fire it could be a person who is close behind them and would have a clean shot. Also, if people knew there were many trained citizens carrying guns, I think it would detour people from doing what they do. I agree with you if we are talking about people just having a gun, but it is a totally different case with CWP's and I guess I need to make that more clear, that I am talking about people getting a CWP.

I do not see it this way...

The crazies you talk about shooting, has nothing to do with CWP, those people that shoot do not have a CWP, they either steal gun or just register one, because the process to get a CWP is super intensive. I do see your point. The CWP process is a very grueling process, not just anybody can get a gun...trust me.

I just read another story about a man who opened fire in a shopping mall killing 8 people, injuring 5 others...2 critically. They found a note that said he wanted "to go out in style." Do you think if more citizens carried guns these people could be stopped in their tracks and help prevent innocent lives from being lost. Some people might not notice right away, but once a couple of shots were fired, someone who could have been carrying a gun could have stopped him, before they got to 13 shots off... I think that if more people carried guns, this stuff would get stopped, before it escalated like the many recent shootings. I am considering getting my CWP, because there are too many crazy people who want to commit suicide, but decide they want to take people's lives with them, cause they want "to go out in style". I think we as a society have gone soft and sue happy and these crazy people know this, and they can walk into a school, mall or just on the street and shoot a bunch of people cause they know we will not do anything...We as a society will not do anything, because we have gone soft and people are fearful that if they to help and take a bad person out, they can get sued by that person for a number of things. I mean police are not pulling the trigger and getting shot themselves, for fear of someone suing. Do I think we need to be a cut throat society? No, not at all...but we need to start standing up for ourselves and not letting these stupid a$$ people do this stuff. I am not going to get into these people's child hoods, because that becomes discussing parenting and that is an entire new can of worms... But I would really like to hear people's thoughts on this...of course we need to keep it flame free...(rock2)

Does anyone else have any thoughts...Nyles help was great, but would love to hear other people's input.

Yes 3 tanks into one sump...the chiller is "T" into the return line, to the tank, and the return from the chiller runs into the sump...

The monti tank would be 24x24x12h... and the frag tank I think would be like 18-20x18-20x10-12h... I will see if I can get a pic drawn up sometime today...

I was thinking of two ways... 1- Have the top tank drain into the lower tank and then the lower tank drain into the main display sump. The return line is split and returns into the top tank. 2- Just have the 2 tanks drain into the sump and then return the water via the return line. I am not sure if I should just use a separate internal pump to return the water...

So, I am wanting to set up two tanks...I want to set up a shallow encrusting monti tank and a small frag tank... I was going to just build a creative shelf thing to conceal my chiller, but got to thinking that maybe I could make it a stand and have two tanks, one smaller one down below (for frags) and then one above it that would be my shallow encrusting monti tank...I know that my chiller, and skimmer are big enough to handle an extra 40-50 gallons of water...I have some ideas, but multiple heads are better then one, so I would like to get some ideas of others might do it...So lets hear the ideas...

This was a sweet post!!! Thanks Ron, I emailed them and I had them super fast, they shipped 1st class and there were no questions asked, and they gave me all I needed...which consisted of 2 #3's, 2 #1's, and 4 #4's...I have not attached them yet, but it is really nice to have...

Hey, have not had this thread in action in a while...I am in there for a bit right now, so if you are bored come on in...

Yeah, sorry...really bad on the update the dual set up has been sold...

There are no verbal altercations...So people can not have a discussion and/or a disagreement? Same old stuff... I have no problems with Nyles and nothing he said I took offense to nor that was stereotypical flaming...not sure why he and I and anyone else for that matter, can not discuss something or merely defend our points of view... as for what the money goes to...I understand this, that was never a question and I never said that this was a club for profit...my guess is that the membership fees do not always cover the cost of the great things that this club does and that some people step up to make up the difference.

I did not say it is a constant that people are belittled about not paying, but it does happen from time to time and that is just to much and it should not happen at all... That is fine...you want to pay for it, more power to you... I simply do not want to pay for it, that is plain and simple. Again you are missing my point and only seeing what you want to see, I do not think that being a member gets you any more credit on the site...again I did it to prove a point, because what was being told to me was that if you were a paying member your thoughts would get more respect...and I knew it would not, so I paid for the membership and it did nothing in that sense, which proved my point. I did not want to pay the money before then and I do not want to pay the money now, not for any reason other then the simple fact that I do not want to pay for it... I guess you and I differ, I was into this hobby, well before I found this site or any other site, I have had some form of salt tank, since I was about 6, so I guess I do not have the same feelings you do. I never said that it was this whole site, there are quite a few people who do not like me and that is totally cool, that has nothing to do with the site and I do not hold it accountable...but I do think there is alot of unnecessary politics in this site... You help out by paying money...I help out by donating and helping people out on the boards as well as chat...

I do not think I took anything Nyle's said out of context, people take shots at me all the time, cause I go against the grain and challenge people on this board. I am a bit extreme in some of my approaches, but oh well...I have calmed down quite a bit, but again I am sure that goes unnoticed as well, but I bet if you ask most people, I am still the trouble maker that l have always been...Like I said, the people in charge are al ot better then other people who were in charge...and the people who are board members and in office now, I really think have great plans,ideas and intentions for this club and give it their heart... Your opinion does matter and so does everyone else's, whether they post once a month and are non-paying or they are paying members, visit every meeting and post on a daily basis and that is how it should be. Your right no one should be belittled or made to feel guilty about paying for a membership...

Nope not all...it just shows how a lot of the people are on this forum, that if you do not pay you are simply taking advantage of the club and I hate that mentality...

I will not be going to the meeting but if someone comes by and wants to get a frag of my acro florida, I would be happy to donate one or two to the club...but again, it depends if someone wants to swing by.

Enlighten me then... I have helped people on this site as well as gotten help, that is why I come to this site and why lots of other people come here and do not pay...there is nothing wrong with that...Why don't you make the club private then, if people who do not pay are on here?