Paratore Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 I know that this topic could go either way but I am going to be building a new sump for my 55 gallon tank and I'm trying to decide if it is worth adding a refugium to it. I currently have a refugium set up on my system but my new protein skimmer doesn't fit so I need a new sump. I have read a lot on the subject but there are so many people for them and against them. It would be about 10 gallons of refugium. What do you guys think?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badxgillen Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Can't think of a reason you would not want one if you could have one, I say go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodus Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Totally! I personally believe for anything over 30 gallons a Sump is a must. That's just my views, there are just so many benefits of using one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbird Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 If you can I would. Adds water volume, good place to grow pods, and helps reduce nutrients. Win win win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pledosophy Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 I can't see any reason why to be against having a refugium if you are going to take care of it properly. With the space you have I would probably go with a bare bottom chaetomorpha refugium. I would skip sand and rock all together. IME there is just not enough benefit in pod production from that small of space that you would see a noticeable difference to warrant the extra care that adding rock and sand would require. If you stick with just the chaetomorpha you can get a large benefit from the nutrient breakdown without the risks of creating a "sink".Pods will still grow like crazy in chaeto as well, so your not sacrificing to much there IME. But as far as products like Miracle mud and what not, you won't see enough of a benefit in a refugium that small to warrant it. The largest benefit will be the breakdown of nutrients, which will also help your protein skimmer to work much more efficiently. If you are carbon dosing you may get to a point like me that even with heavy feeding of your system you are unable to keep any algae alive in your refugium. If that happens, then a refugium will be of little benefit to you. JME Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandinga Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 keep her trimmed and you'll be happy:) I pull out probably 75% of my chaeto every two-three weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JManrow Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 On top of a those good reasons to have one, it's nice to have an area for more delicate organisms like tiny feather dusters, etc., that would normally be eaten in the display tank. I'm moving the small amount of Xenia to just my refugium, before it gets a chance to take over the tank! I have some awesome large fluorescent green Palys in the too, that Mandinga gave me. I know they have strong palytoxin, so that seemed the best place for them. I'm definitely a refugium fan. Go for it! I had tons of pods in there, but they ended up being overtaken by Mysis Shrimp. It's still a good tradeoff. They mostly eat copepods, and there are still a lot of Gammarus (amphipods). Refugiums take on a life of their own! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paratore Posted May 7, 2015 Author Share Posted May 7, 2015 I can't see any reason why to be against having a refugium if you are going to take care of it properly. With the space you have I would probably go with a bare bottom chaetomorpha refugium. I would skip sand and rock all together. IME there is just not enough benefit in pod production from that small of space that you would see a noticeable difference to warrant the extra care that adding rock and sand would require. If you stick with just the chaetomorpha you can get a large benefit from the nutrient breakdown without the risks of creating a "sink".Pods will still grow like crazy in chaeto as well, so your not sacrificing to much there IME. But as far as products like Miracle mud and what not, you won't see enough of a benefit in a refugium that small to warrant it. The largest benefit will be the breakdown of nutrients, which will also help your protein skimmer to work much more efficiently. If you are carbon dosing you may get to a point like me that even with heavy feeding of your system you are unable to keep any algae alive in your refugium. If that happens, then a refugium will be of little benefit to you. JME On top of a those good reasons to have one, it's nice to have an area for more delicate organisms like tiny feather dusters, etc., that would normally be eaten in the display tank. I'm moving the small amount of Xenia to just my refugium, before it gets a chance to take over the tank! I have some awesome large fluorescent green Palys in the too, that Mandinga gave me. I know they have strong palytoxin, so that seemed the best place for them. I'm definitely a refugium fan. Go for it! I had tons of pods in there, but they ended up being overtaken by Mysis Shrimp. It's still a good tradeoff. They mostly eat copepods, and there are still a lot of Gammarus (amphipods). Refugiums take on a life of their own! Thank you both for all the information!! I know that JME said to keep it bare bottom with just chaeto but what is your two cents JManrow? Also, should I have the cheato tumbling? Stock it with pods or what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JManrow Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 The bare bottom/substrate debate really doesn't have a right or wrong answer. I have kept both. For ease of maintenance, bare bottom may be better. I like substrate for aesthetic reasons and for burrowing organisms. It is all a matter of personal preference. If you have a refugium, it would seem best to have the pods. I don't see a point of having so much current in a refugium that the Chaeto tumbles. You can stock it with pods(copepods, amphipods), although eventually they will usually find their way into your tank! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paratore Posted May 7, 2015 Author Share Posted May 7, 2015 The bare bottom/substrate debate really doesn't have a right or wrong answer. I have kept both. For ease of maintenance, bare bottom may be better. I like substrate for aesthetic reasons and for burrowing organisms. It is all a matter of personal preference. If you have a refugium, it would seem best to have the pods. I don't see a point of having so much current in a refugium that the Chaeto tumbles. You can stock it with pods(copepods, amphipods), although eventually they will usually find their way into your tank! Sounds good to me! Thank you! One another note, where do you guys get pods for your refugiums? The only place I have found them is at my LFS but they are a pretty penny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Z Reef Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 I think bare bottom is easier to prevent detritus buildup. I know when I had a remote fuge and finally removed it there was lots of detritus at the bottom (even with a filter sock and skimmer before it). If you have the chaeto tumble it avoids this and grows the ball 360 degrees around. I don't personally tumble mine but don't keep sand either to avoid any buildup. As said, both methods work. Pods can be bought or you can get some cheato from the share thread from someone who has them already. Also some keep "pod condos" that can be transferred to others tanks to seed them with pods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JManrow Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Just ask in the forum. I'm sure someone will be glad to give you some. Right now, I may have a few large amphipods, but I have mostly Mysis Shrimp, which seem to do great in tanks that are already established with copepods! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JManrow Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 I just checked my 20g high tank, which is almost packed with Chaetomorpha any. I have 3 young Banggai Cardinals about an inch long in there. There are keeping the their tank pretty much pod-free! You would think pods would be hiding in a 2 foot across mat of macroalgae! haha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paratore Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 I think bare bottom is easier to prevent detritus buildup. I know when I had a remote fuge and finally removed it there was lots of detritus at the bottom (even with a filter sock and skimmer before it). If you have the chaeto tumble it avoids this and grows the ball 360 degrees around. I don't personally tumble mine but don't keep sand either to avoid any buildup. As said, both methods work. Pods can be bought or you can get some cheato from the share thread from someone who has them already. Also some keep "pod condos" that can be transferred to others tanks to seed them with pods. Thank you for your input! I think I'm going to leave it bare bottom! hmm never thought of keeping pod condos. Going to have to do that so when its my time I can share the love! Just ask in the forum. I'm sure someone will be glad to give you some. Right now, I may have a few large amphipods, but I have mostly Mysis Shrimp, which seem to do great in tanks that are already established with copepods! Once I have my refugium all set up I will defiantly hit up the people of PNWMAS for some pods! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paratore Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 Just ask in the forum. I'm sure someone will be glad to give you some. Right now, I may have a few large amphipods, but I have mostly Mysis Shrimp, which seem to do great in tanks that are already established with copepods! What is the advantage to keeping Mysis shrimp instead of having lots of pods? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JManrow Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 This is from our ReefStar Sponsor link. http://www.reefs2go.com/product/INV_POD-250/Live-Foods-for-Feeding-Aquarium-Fish-Inverts-Corals-Amphipods-copepods.html Great price and free shipping. Not sure how long this deal will last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avsdragon Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 Question, I am looking to start up a copeopod culture, I have a filter pad and 2 bio stones in my sump should I remove those and just get a chaetomorpha to put in my sump. or keep the stones and pad and add the chaetomorpha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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