luv951 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I have read on RC that you can use playground sand for a DSB, but have heard that it has to be a certain brand. Does anyone know if a local HD carries the stuff, and what is the brand name I should look for? If not at HD, then where can I get some locally? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pledosophy Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 The name is Southdown. I'm not sure if anyone around here carries it. How much do you need? I should have mentioned it, I do have some argonite, it was in the tubberware in the garage right next to the tank. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mister crabs Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 ryan at advanced had some last i checked but advanced is now closed. might see if anyone can get ahold of him or maybe another LFS bought out his drygoods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv951 Posted November 14, 2007 Author Share Posted November 14, 2007 Thanks, Kevin - I need hundreds of pounds, not sure exactly how much, but probably 100-150 or so - enough to make a 6 inch bed in a 4 x 2 tank MisterCrabs - isnt Advanced in Salem? If so, I think they are still there, anyone else know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael7979 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Advanced Aquarium is closing and I'm pretty sure there is no Southdown there. Yes it is in Salem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanz Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 If I remember correctly...HD doesn't carry the type of brand here, just in the East coast they do. Isn't play sand really fine though? You'd probably have to wash it for days to get it to clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I have searched many times for this sand in eastern washington. another name for it is as newcastle but I did not find any. Woody at seahorse aquarium has sand in bulk that he sells. Not sure of the price though. Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I actually believe that southdown/newcastle is no longer producing the sand that is ok for our tanks...I did do some reading that everyone's fear of having sillica in their sand and having that in the tank is a horrible thing, some people are saying it is not nearly as bad...but I may have that very wrong.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanz Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I think Impur uses play sand and he said he has no problems with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 You can get 100lbs of white silica sand at most construction/masonry/stone supply places for $8-10. I've used it for 3 years with no problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I actually believe that southdown/newcastle is no longer producing the sand that is ok for our tanks...I did do some reading that everyone's fear of having sillica in their sand and having that in the tank is a horrible thing' date=' some people are saying it is not nearly as bad...but I may have that very wrong....[/quote'] The problem is the notion that silica leads to algae/diatoms. And it does, they feed off silicates in part. But how much pressure do you think is needed to break down a particle of silica sand? Or how long do you think it would take to dissolve? I'd guess it'd take the pressure of a wave in the ocean, or maybe even 5000 waves? Think we can recreate the pressure created by one single wave in our tanks? What do you think the galss is made out of? Randy Holmes-Farley doses silcates into his reef tank. Dr. Ron Shimek has a study on different sands and the outcome showed that silica sands has the most diversity of life/bacteria due to the varied particle sizes. Here is a good article by Rob Toonan http://www.reefs.org/library/article/r_toonen9.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronjunior Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Lowes sells (used to, check the bag) 100# bags of commercial grade white silica sand for about $8/bag. (sugar fine) I used it, and swapped out for a thicker grade aragonite. The silica sand was a pain in the butt for blowing all over the rocks in my experience. If you don't have much flow at the bottom of the tank, it might not be that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mbeef61 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 what about buffering ability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 If your sand provided any buffering ability, we wouldn't have to use CA reactors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mbeef61 Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 sorry ph stability Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv951 Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 For one of my businesses, I was always buying concrete and related products, so I have wholesale accounts at some concrete supply companies. I will call around and see who has the stuff and report back what I find - I think that someone in the area must sell it and I do know that many of the "wholesale to the trade" operations of that nature really don't care if non-business owners buy from them. Masons supply is one of the better ones and they will sell to anyone IME Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 sorry ph stability Sand does not affect your pH. Otherwise we wouldn't have bare bottom tanks that are so successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mbeef61 Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 oh really? then what causes the world famous BB crash? we have CA reactors because we ovestock...otherwise i think it would work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badguitarist Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 aragonite sand will buffer your tank, as aragonite dissolves at a lower Ph than crushed coral. It will release buffers into the water as well as calcium. Anyone whos run a tank with an aragonite substrate will tell you every few years you will have to add more. so you see some sands actually do buffer your water and help stabilize the Ph. As far as buffering capabilities of silica go i have no clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 oh really? then what causes the world famous BB crash? we have CA reactors because we ovestock...otherwise i think it would work I would imagine the same thing that causes the world famous DSB crash. We have CA reactors to supply alk/calcium that is taken up as corals grow, because the pH in our tanks does not get low enough to dissolve argonite media such as argonite sand. Corals would not survive at that pH range. Facts are facts. I can't really argue against them. You may if you like. There is plenty of info out there to back up what i've stated here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mbeef61 Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 post links please.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacklabel7 Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Being that a few people say they have silica sand and there is a lot of proof against silica being bad in tanks, I think the hundreds of dollars saved is kind of worth the try. Plus you could probably get the exact sand you wanted by buying from a quarry. Any objections to trying it out? Ive been thinking about switching my sand out anyways so it seems this opportunity is screamin my name. Let me know if im about to make a mistake... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badguitarist Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Impur I am not arguing that silica sand doesnt work, I am arguing your point that Aragonite wont dissolve in salt water. Aragonite will dissolve at a Ph over 8.0 (http://www.aquabuys.com/page/aqb/CTGY/z2i), right around where we keep our saltwater systems at. yes i do agree that calcium reactors/ two part mixes/kalkvasser are important if you have a large population of fast growing stony corals (as most of us do). but the fact is, homeboy, that aragonite does dissolve in saltwater fish tanks. i have to add sand every year to keep up with the amount that dissolves into the water column, and not just a bit, Im talking around 60 pounds every summer. so please go to the link i provided above to answer any more questions you have about sand dissolving in a reef tank. thank you for you time, Please note i am not trying to argue or pick on anyone I am just trying to set the facts strait for anyone reading this, I will not reply to anything else on this thread unless i feel it is constructive. One last message to anyone who reads this, only let your ego be as large as your knowledge of the aquatic sciences!! Have a good day everyone!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacklabel7 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Well I did it... I went down to Lowes in Salem and bought 100 lbs. of "Commercial Grade Quikrete Medium Sand". The bag says that it MAY contain Crystalline Silica so that pretty much means I bought Silica Sand. It looks pretty and I just recently took in a dying Goniopora, so that is the only "living" thing in my tank besides the snails and hermits. I've heard the bad stories and my LFS told me that I need to take it out... I believe him but I just dont have anything in my tank to kill and I want to take the chance. I'll let you know how it does... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Hey that looks great! You are going to be fine, remember since aragonite dissolves so fast in our tanks like homey up above says, and since your rock is made up of the same thing, your rock is just going to dissolve really quick. Like 60 lbs a year!!!! On the serious side, since you do not have a DSB (where any aragonite might dissolve due to lower pH levels), you will not see any difference in your params. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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