impur Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 I've been having a tough time balancing my calcium/alk/mag. Every morning i'm adding about 1 cup of alk solution from Randy's 2 part recipe, along with 3-5 tablespoons of mag. Each evening i'm adding 3 capfulls of Kent liquid calcium, which is double the recommended dosage for my tank. In addition to this i'm dosing kalk in my topoff at 2 teaspoons per gallon and doing weekly WCs. I tested last night: calcium 270ppm alk 8.3 mag 1320 ph 8.6 I'm adding so much that i'm getting precipitation on the walls of my sump, but its just not going up. I'm afraid if i start adding more of each then i'll risk stressing corals. I guess i need to get a dosing pump so i can dose over the course of a day instead of at once. But the biggest problem is i just can't get my calcium up! On top of this, i'm going on vacation soon so i won't be able to dose. I plan to have some small cups with the different solutions for the ppl watching my place to dump in, i hope that will keeps things from getting too low until i get back. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigjohnwoody Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 That's weird! I guess the things that come to mind are, how new are your test kits, and are you adding it really slow in a high flow area, or just tossing it in? This is why I like the dosing pumps because it's a really slow drip. I am switching to a calcium reactor though just to make things even more consistent and natural. I doubt that's any help but figured I would try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald525 Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Miles have you made any recent changes? Any new additions to your tank? Beth was having a heck of a time getting the calcium up in our tank even with dosing and we finally had to switch to a more concentrated calcium solution. Our thoughts were that with all the new sps additions and the addition of the big clam and the incredible growth we are getting from the elos that there was just a higher calcium demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted May 24, 2011 Author Share Posted May 24, 2011 No real changes, i added a few SPS and my mummy eye mother colony over the weekend, but I have been having trouble with the calcium for a month or so. I'm only dealing with about 10-15gal less than my last tank, i guess i didn't think i would see this much difference in uptake, especially considering i have significantly less corals in this tank than the last. My calcium has actually gone down about 80ppm in the last week regardless of my dosing double the recommended dosage. I'm going to try to get someone to double check my calcium test kit tonight and go from there. If its correct, i guess maybe i need to add more calcium more frequently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPaquatics Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 I would check the test kit and how you are adding the solution...the precipitate on the walls of your sump lead me to believe you may be adding it too fast and it is precipitating before it can go into solution...add it slower and a few hours apart from the alk part. If you are adding it, then it should go up...makes me think its either not getting in (precipitating) or test kit is wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grassi Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Yes, check the kit. Your skimmer could take up a lot as well. About 90% of the collection cup product is calcium. Calcium binds with proteins (or viceversa) quite easily. When I switched from the bubble magus nac6 to the atb 1040 my ca dropped from 520 to 390 in a few days. Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigjohnwoody Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 That's great info grassi! Thanks for sharing that. Never would have thought of that but it completely makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grassi Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Yep, it surprised me too when I first noticed. Tu be sure I ran a tub of saltwater with the skimmer only, nothing else. The calcium was decreasing. I then found some articles online (that I can't find right now) where there was some testing done on the collection cup content and there is where I got the number (90% or so if I remember well). It is not my field, and maybe some member in the medical field can chime in, but I think that a similar relation between protein and calcium uptake is in act every day inside our bodies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGooseWhisperer Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 dusting out the cell bio cobwebs, I seem to recall that the major function of bone having so much calcium is that it is essentially a bank for the bodies needs. Calcium is a very critical ion in the cell and many proteins/enzymes depend on it for their function/regulation. Makes sense that marine systems use it just as much (probably more) so all those skimmed off organics are going to be full of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald525 Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Not sure it's the same as in the human body but if a person has higher than normal or lower than normal levels of protein then it can affect the measurement of calcium in the blood. Total calcium is usually a good reflection of free calcium since the free and bound forms are typically each about half of the total. However, because about half the calcium in blood is bound to protein, total calcium test results can be affected by high or low levels of protein. In such cases, it is more useful to measure free calcium directly using an ionized calcium test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.R Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 I agree with double checking your test kit. If you can't find anyone to test it with their kit you might always try testing some fresh salt water before doing a water change and comparing it to what the vendor says their salt should be at. I know the Kent Reef Salt is pretty right on from they advertise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Not sure it's the same as in the human body but if a person has higher than normal or lower than normal levels of protein then it can affect the measurement of calcium in the blood. Total calcium is usually a good reflection of free calcium since the free and bound forms are typically each about half of the total. However, because about half the calcium in blood is bound to protein, total calcium test results can be affected by high or low levels of protein. In such cases, it is more useful to measure free calcium directly using an ionized calcium test. thanks doc! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h2odvl Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Here are the results from testing Miles and My water with my API and Salifert test and Miles Salifert test *****API | JSal | MSal Jacob 620 | 465 | 500 Miles 340 | 275 | 290 API= API JSal= Jacobs salifert Msal= Miles salifert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breefcase Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Hey Miles, It might be possible that your pH is too high, causing the calcium precipitation. After adding calcium, and you get a precipitate, you can actually end up with less in solution than you started with, but the pH goes up. As mentioned earlier, some of the precipitate can get removed through your skimmer. You might try to decrease the pH to 8.2 or so (very slowly, with a little vinegar), Then add only the reccomended additives, not extra. my $0.02 I've been having a tough time balancing my calcium/alk/mag. Every morning i'm adding about 1 cup of alk solution from Randy's 2 part recipe, along with 3-5 tablespoons of mag. Each evening i'm adding 3 capfulls of Kent liquid calcium, which is double the recommended dosage for my tank. In addition to this i'm dosing kalk in my topoff at 2 teaspoons per gallon and doing weekly WCs. I tested last night: calcium 270ppm alk 8.3 mag 1320 ph 8.6 I'm adding so much that i'm getting precipitation on the walls of my sump, but its just not going up. I'm afraid if i start adding more of each then i'll risk stressing corals. I guess i need to get a dosing pump so i can dose over the course of a day instead of at once. But the biggest problem is i just can't get my calcium up! On top of this, i'm going on vacation soon so i won't be able to dose. I plan to have some small cups with the different solutions for the ppl watching my place to dump in, i hope that will keeps things from getting too low until i get back. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saltfinsax Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 I have been told that your PH is really a indicator on your water. If it too low or too hight then something in the water is out a whack. If you just change the PH, your really not fixing the water problem. So saying that, if all your parameters are right then your PH is right. If one of the three is way to high Alk, Calc,or Mag then it pushes the other out of the water. I hope this is right what I have been told anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coralreefer Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Miles--stop adding til you have an answer...I just went through the same thing and it was a "new" read "bad" test kit...make sure parameters are verified before adding another chemical... DrMerle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeFit Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 alot of sound advice on here. here is an article that should help you troubleshoot your problem. it has worked for me. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/11/chemistry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grassi Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 That's a nice article, like most written by Holmes-Farley. On a slightly different topic, a lot of times I read posts of people being proud of their coralline growth. That's not a good sign. Coralline algae should be present in a minimum amount. It should not grow like crazy on walls and pumps. Too much coralline is a sign of an unbalanced system. That said, I think you should get a doser. I used to have similar issues (unbalance, but in my case low ph and high ca), that I solved when I added the Bubble Magus doser. I remember you wanted to get one too some months ago. I really like mine. I can drive the system to the right spot that I want, slowly and easily. And it works also when you are on vacation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h2odvl Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Miles I did some reading and found that some people that had low calcium with other parameters in normal range also had new rock. They attributed it to the rock absorbing the calcium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonBoy Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 I've been told that if the salinity is low it affects how everything will balance out, just another out there thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted May 25, 2011 Author Share Posted May 25, 2011 Alex you were supposed to tell me when you were getting one!! I was gonna go in with you! Oh well :P Kevin that could be. I added 6 capfuls of Kent liquid calcium yesterday and the calcium went up 20ppm. Maybe i'll add some vinegar to my ATO, that will drive down the pH of the kalk solution and also allow me to squeeze out a little more calcium/alk from it too. Jacob hmm thats interesting. All of this rock is new..... My biggest concern is that i'm going on vacation and won't be able to monitor things, so I need to get the parameters in line this week. Then i'll set up some small cups of alk/calcium for them to dose each day for me. Maybe i'll try turning off the skimmer when i dose. I picked up some Kent Liquid Calcium Reactor, this stuff is pretty cool it has magnesium in it too so kinda 2 birds 1 stone deal. I just started using it yesterday. Guess all i can really do is keep dosing and keep testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted May 25, 2011 Author Share Posted May 25, 2011 I've been told that if the salinity is low it affects how everything will balance out' date=' just another out there thought.[/quote'] Thanks, yah i do check my SG weekly and its sitting perfect at 35ppt. I even calibrated my refractometer with 0ppt solution to make sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted May 26, 2011 Author Share Posted May 26, 2011 Over the last 2 days i have added 10 capfuls (5 times the recommended dosage) of kent calcium and my calcium has dropped 20ppm WTH??????? My skimmer is shut off during this time as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted May 26, 2011 Author Share Posted May 26, 2011 I'm starting to think i should be adding more of the calcium to my tank at once. Using this calculator http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html it states i need 141.9ml of Kent Liquid Calcium to raise my calcium 50ppm. One capful is 5ml. So i have only added 50ml, 90ml short to raise it just 50ppm. Guess i need to pickup another bottle of this stuff yikes. I'm gonna need to do a DIY for calcium solution like i do for alk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgrcrain Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 I was kind of wondering if that might be your issue(not enough). I'm using the weaker brs mix and it takes something like a quart to go up 50ppm in my 120. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.