Anyone dosing vodka/sugar/vinegar?

[finch6013]

oh I wondered maybe I could improve but sounds like I dont need it. At the moment I have good color growth and very little diatom

[impur]

I have great growth, and no diatoms. I'd like a little extra color from my acros, and the main reason i'm dosing is to try and starve out the red turf algae.

 

My PO4 and NO3 both test out at 0.

[Byrd]

My experiance with vodka dosing-SUCKS

 

I had NO3 at about 20 or so and really wanted to get it down, I spent about a month researching sites/threads I ran into this which I am sure you have read;

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php

I erred on the side of caution as to amounts I satrted with .25ml of vodka and at day 7 when my Giant Tear drop Clam died, and I noticed my Tyree toadstool had not opened in 4 days and... and... and....- so I stopped.

 

DEAD;

I monitor my tank so well I can honestly say it was the vodka dosing. My skimmer pulls great "sludge and I was overly cautious as to the amount I dosed.

The next night I watched my Bellas Angel die in about 2 hours-went from swimming AND eating to DEAD.

DEAD;

 

My NO3 never got down and my PO4 was only at .06 before dosing.

 

After reading more after it all happened I decided to try Purigen a product by Seachem.

My NO3 had always been around 20-25ppm, after 9 days of Purigen my NO3 is at less than 1ppm

 

My test kits are Salifert.

 

Dose if you want to, but having to have "so many things, perfect" ie skimmer, total water volume per dosing amount etc, and if one thing is not right you might kill off things-not for me.

 

I took what Vodka was left and am saving it for the weekends, maybe a screwdriver or 30.

 

My posts of 12 or whatever is not refelective of how long I have been at this, I got back into it last year after doing reef tanks 16 years ago. Not a nube here.

Dosing gets a zero in my book-you have to do it daily, I know if you miss a day or so no big deal just continue were you left off, if you over dose-death, if your skimmer stops-death if if if.

 

weigh the pros and cons- My experiance will never have me an advocate..

 

Just hate to see you loose stuff, even if you have been doing it succesfully-when it goes South it goes WAY SOUTH(flame)

[FishKiler]

chewie, you say we need to watch the alkalinity and keep it at 8, why?

 

I just restarted dosing and my dkh 8 and growth was significantly slowed so I bumped it up last time checked at 9.4 dkh. I am using kalk in all of my top off and alk drops off now and then.

 

@Rick, I was probably not very clear - what I would like to find out is what range of dosing is reasonable. From reading what people post on RC some people dose quite heavily. Every system is different, yet there is a reasonable limit that 99% of our systems have no reason to cross. On the other hand I am certain that if I take a 1ml of vodka and put it into my system (~100G) with out slowly increasing like it say in the article, nothing bad will happen; will probably not notice any difference.

 

Another experience I had with vodka was when starting a nano ~9g. I put in water from an established tank and thought I could get it to cycle faster by addin 2ml of vodka, that was interesting and did see a full bacterial bloom.

[Byrd]

, nothing bad will happen; will probably not notice any difference.

 

 

Duuuuuuuuuuude if you kill off things does that fall under the good or bad catagory(plotting)??

 

Just messing I obviously did somethng wrong but [language filter], what exactly is your goal?-Zero NO3 and zero PO4-more than one way to skin a cat

 

Hind sight 20/20(flame)

 

Peace out(clap)

 

LOL@M

[COReefer]

I had sorta the same experience with vodka as byrd. I started out really low and gradually increased over a couple of weeks. I noticed a few burnt tips on my sps and had read on rc that it is normal and they recover fine. Then I saw that the tops of all of my sps were starting to burn and actually die. My clam even stopped opening all the way. It seemed to have only been affecting the top half of the tank. At the same time I started dosing, I changed reflectors on my tank so........ I'm not sure what made the difference. I however stopped dosing and put a piece of glass between my bulbs and the water. Every thing is making a full recovery and looks great. So I'm thinking the vodka may have cleared the water so much plus the addition of the reflectors, the corals just couldn't tolerate?????

[FishKiler]

@Byrd, like I said "nothing bad will happen to MY system". I just started dosing again and started at 1ml, .5 in am and .5 in pm, also dosed with MB7 and nothing BAD happened. Everything looks better so far.

 

My goal with vodka dosing is not exactly 0 NO3 PO4. I am looking to improve my nutrient export via skimmer, my thinking is that the tank has NO3 PO4 that does not skim. When I dose MB7 and vodka the bacteria consumes carbon and NO3/PO4 then gets skimmed out. I have tried GFO and still use it, but vodka is cheaper and lasts longer. I also tried the macro algae approach, again the levels of nutrient are low enough to where it just doesn't grow. When the levels are high enough to feed the algae they are way above ideal. I also tried the turf algae scrubber and it did work somewhat, I just did not trust it enough to rely on it. From reading a lot of forums it seems to me that vodka is becoming an established method. I may not be right for everyone but for the short term it has worked for me.

[Byrd]

The thread reply came of reading terrible, it was not meant poorly. I was implying that if something was to die that would be a bad thing. My biggest worry is that "what if" factor.

For me it may have been (actually had to have been) my skimmer I used to have the AquaC EV-180, I have no idea why I read some of the reviews I've read on the Aqua skimmers, I have a AquaC Remora and the EV180, and they BOTH SUCK-LOL-Did I mention they are for sale?

 

Presently I am running a phosban reactor and the Purigen by Seachem-tested water last night PO4.03-tested with the Hanna Meter and NO3-.2-Salifert. those are levels I can live with all day, and I dont have to dose twice a day-

"Set it and forget it" to coin a phrase

My NO4 has always been low due to the reactor (I would assume) since I do nothing other than H2O changes.

Before starting to use the Purigen, my NO3 would be 25 by now-I used to change out 20 gallons every other week, I am on week 3 without a change and will start doing monthly changes now-maybe longer-I supplement for Trace elements with Coral Vite, plus I dose Iodine, and Stronium/Molybenium.

 

I almost did the whole turf scrubber-the outcome sounded great but after a month and asking alot who tried and stopped,I decided against-then I see the article about dosing-Either I wish I had not or had a SKIMMER that worked. I am sure it was the lack of skimmer.

 

I hope it all goe well-sounds like it will and is-Im just jaded(flame)

[impur]

My clam is not looking good. When i got home yesterday it wasn't open hardly at all, and its byssal threads were releasing from the rock it has sat on for over 3 years. I moved it down onto the sand. I'm hoping that the vodka is clearing the water making it too bright for the clam where it was at.

 

Any one have problems with clams while dosing?

[impur]

Well its dead this morning. That was the oldest thing i had, got it a month after i setup my tank :(

[Rick]

That's a bummer. I've been dosing for a few months with no adverse effects that I can see. I'm still working my way up to the amount that will be effective at reducing nitrates though. (Swapping to the larger tank didn't help as I have to figure out what it is doing now before I increase the amount any more)

[Byrd]

My clam is not looking good. When i got home yesterday it wasn't open hardly at all, and its byssal threads were releasing from the rock it has sat on for over 3 years. I moved it down onto the sand. I'm hoping that the vodka is clearing the water making it too bright for the clam where it was at.

 

Any one have problems with clams while dosing?

 

Sorry I did not see this sooner, I had the same experiance my Giant Tear Drop died, but I also lost a Bellas Angel. The only good thing, if I can use that term loosely is my Rose Bulb Anemone split from the stress so now I have 2 and the LFS will give me 40.00 dollars for it- Now I am only out 130.00

 

I got somewhat lucky, when taking a frag to the LFS yesterday he happened to have a 2.5 inch Tear Drop Maxima, I sucked it up fast- not as nice as the 6inch one I KILLED though-but i have been looking for one for over a month-the closest I found was an 8 inch one for 175.00-TOO BIG.

 

Sorry about your loss.

 

Question for you and it is really a question- What was the purpose for your dosing, reduce NO3 & PO4 or what?

[Byrd]

That's a bummer. I've been dosing for a few months with no adverse effects that I can see. I'm still working my way up to the amount that will be effective at reducing nitrates though. (Swapping to the larger tank didn't help as I have to figure out what it is doing now before I increase the amount any more)

 

Rick is the reason you are dosing to reduce the NO3?

 

I ask only becuase that was my only reason, my NO4 stays around .02-.04

but my NO3 was always at 20-25ppm between H2O changes.

I've since (about 2-3 weeks now) been using that Purigen I mentioned, my NO3 is constant at about 1ppm (could be less but not more) and I am using a Salifert test.

 

My goal was the reduced NO3 and the Purigen is a drop in my filter sock and FORGET it, no need for daily this, and daily that-FYI

[impur]

Sorry I did not see this sooner, I had the same experiance my Giant Tear Drop died, but I also lost a Bellas Angel. The only good thing, if I can use that term loosely is my Rose Bulb Anemone split from the stress so now I have 2 and the LFS will give me 40.00 dollars for it- Now I am only out 130.00

 

I got somewhat lucky, when taking a frag to the LFS yesterday he happened to have a 2.5 inch Tear Drop Maxima, I sucked it up fast- not as nice as the 6inch one I KILLED though-but i have been looking for one for over a month-the closest I found was an 8 inch one for 175.00-TOO BIG.

 

Sorry about your loss.

 

Question for you and it is really a question- What was the purpose for your dosing, reduce NO3 & PO4 or what?

 

I have 0 readings for both N and P. My reason is to try and starve out the red turf algae that has been the bane of my reefkeeping existance. I am willing to try anything to get rid of it, even if it means losing my clam.

[Byrd]

WOW-

"Red Slime Control" by Blue Life

Works for me-Not sure about the "turf", mine was like cyno bacteria

 

Good luck with your endevour

[impur]

Nah its not cyano. Its like small red bristles growing on things. Impossible to remove manually and nothing eats it. It came on the 1st rock i bought and just spreads.

[ClayTheSavageFraser]

did you see the vodka dosing instructions that I posted yesterday? I am going to start today!!

 

Clay

[impur]

Good luck!

 

I just put in an order for some Microbacter7 and CoralAmino from Brightwell to help repopulate the bacteria and add some amino acids to help my SPS get more color

[Rick]

Rick is the reason you are dosing to reduce the NO3?

 

I ask only becuase that was my only reason, my NO4 stays around .02-.04

but my NO3 was always at 20-25ppm between H2O changes.

I've since (about 2-3 weeks now) been using that Purigen I mentioned, my NO3 is constant at about 1ppm (could be less but not more) and I am using a Salifert test.

 

My goal was the reduced NO3 and the Purigen is a drop in my filter sock and FORGET it, no need for daily this, and daily that-FYI

 

Yes, I need to get my nitrates down. I wish mine were 20-25.

 

After a few months of dosing I had worked my way up to 6 ml. a day and while the corals were looking much brighter my nitrates were still around 80. After changing to the bigger tank this came down to about 60 but the water change would account for that difference. Just to see what happened I tossed a tablespoon of sugar in day before yesterday in addition to the 6 ml. of vodka. esterday I awoke to a cloud much like you would see for a few hours after moving stuff around. It differed though in that it did not clear up from the bottom of the tank up. It just hung around all day. I did notice that many of the corals had more polyp extension than normal as well. A test showed the Nitrates at 40 yesterday so they have started to come down as well. Last night the tank cleared and the tank is now clear as a bell. In a couple of days I'll see if the nitrates are still dropping and adjust the dosing accordingly.

 

Does anyone know how much carbon a tablespoon of sugar has compared to the vodka? I want to use a mix of both but I don't want to overdo it. I'm sure the sugar is what caused the bloom in it yesterday but I can't tell if it was too much or just enough to kick things into gear. My thought is to cut back to 3 ml of vodka and 1 teaspoon of sugar daily but for all I know that still may be too much.

[Rick]

did you see the vodka dosing instructions that I posted yesterday? I am going to start today!!

 

Clay

 

I may be wrong but I think most of us are using those instructions as a starting point. It's too bad they don't include sugar dosing instructions, I would like to try a mixture of both but I'm not sure how much sugar I should be starting with.

[Byrd]

Hey Rick, just a thought, as it has worked for me and as far as all the threads I have ran across-That Purigen has enabled me to do water changes monthly as to bi-monthly.

I feed my fish pellets daily. Brine, mysyis every 3rd day, on the days I am not feeding fish brine(spiralina-sp?) I am target feeding my Dendros, Duncans and hammer, frogspawn, and torchs. In addition to that I use reef nutritions Oyster and Phyto feast, PLUS cyclopeze.

I mention only for the reason in my opinion, I think I add alot of nutrients and to have NO3 at 1 after a month when I used to hit the 25 every other week-

Well Im happy with the results-

My Params are

NO3-1

PO4-.05 (or less)

SG 1.025 MG 1380

Kh 11

I supplement Trace elements, Stronium/Molybenum and Iodine

 

my 2 cents worth

Just trying to share something that has worked, I've already tried something that did not-Tonight I am drinking the rest of my Vodka Dosing-(drinking)

[Byrd]

photos from last month;

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dsoz]

In my 75g tank I have been using sugar.

 

I started with 1 cup of sugar dissolved in a 20 oz water bottle. Then I put in 10-20 ml of sugar solution into the tank. I started with 10ml, and worked up to 20 ml a day.

 

You can use the same formula (scaled up) for your tank. Then I would start increasing the dose just like you did with the alcohol until you start getting results.

 

dsoz

[Rick]

In my 75g tank I have been using sugar.

 

I started with 1 cup of sugar dissolved in a 20 oz water bottle. Then I put in 10-20 ml of sugar solution into the tank. I started with 10ml, and worked up to 20 ml a day.

 

You can use the same formula (scaled up) for your tank. Then I would start increasing the dose just like you did with the alcohol until you start getting results.

 

dsoz

 

Thanks, That kind of gives me an idea where to start.

[Rick]

Hey Rick, just a thought, as it has worked for me and as far as all the threads I have ran across-That Purigen has enabled me to do water changes monthly as to bi-monthly.

I feed my fish pellets daily. Brine, mysyis every 3rd day, on the days I am not feeding fish brine(spiralina-sp?) I am target feeding my Dendros, Duncans and hammer, frogspawn, and torchs. In addition to that I use reef nutritions Oyster and Phyto feast, PLUS cyclopeze.

I mention only for the reason in my opinion, I think I add alot of nutrients and to have NO3 at 1 after a month when I used to hit the 25 every other week-

Well Im happy with the results-

My Params are

NO3-1

PO4-.05 (or less)

SG 1.025 MG 1380

Kh 11

I supplement Trace elements, Stronium/Molybenum and Iodine

 

my 2 cents worth

Just trying to share something that has worked, I've already tried something that did not-Tonight I am drinking the rest of my Vodka Dosing-(drinking)

 

Thanks for the tips, what I've been doing so far is working for everything except the high nitrates which seem to be moving in the right direction and I don't have to dose any trace elements except iodine which I dose lightly once a week. I use to dose 3 part but I stopped that a couple of months ago when I switched salt. (My calcium is at or above 420 and if I recall right mg was around 1300)