It's Time

[CCR]

I’m frustrated. I guess I just don’t see. I can’t even tell ya what I’m look-in for. Even that’s a problem; there is nothing to look for. What I can say is this club needs a kick in the [language filter], or it’s worthless. I see barely any posting anymore. Nothing educational. Only, who got what new stock in. Now please, don’t bother to tell me its summer and everyone is busy. I’m busy!!!! It get’s a little old to see as many members as I do posting away at the other sites, not hardly ever here, and not even, again, not even half as much as when I joined. (Hell, could be me)

BBQ another story. Yes, name tags were nice, lets have Randy (No offence meant to him in anyway) talk forever, I would have gone in, but no room and hot. Yes I said I had already seen his stuff, and like it. But when I opened the door and it was packed, I’d rather be polite and not bother the others trying to find a place. My choice. But I sure wouldn’t have stayed that long outside

Seventy five people there. I new, kind of, four, and guess what. I haven’t talked to really anyone since. Point being, if you didn’t know somebody, you’re screwed. Not one other person, unless I started, or tried to, said a friggin thing to me yes, yes, yes….. All the thank you to be they go.

 

But I found that some people haven’t changed a bit. I stopped by a shop on the way home. I had $800.00 in cash in my pocket ready to spend on what ever I wanted.

It (shop keepers) had the same arrogant attitude as usual, that stopped me. So I left. And I will never go back. I just thought I would give it the benefit of the doubt, even though, my wife said she would never go back, and my son-in-law didn’t go with me to the bbq, because he new I was going to that particular store. And no I will not say were. I don’t care.

I guess it was just another thing that makes me angrier about the BBQ. I wanted to meet nice people, then went to the came crap from 4 year ago.

 

MY POINT BEING IS THIS

If you want to sell. Great.

If you’re a shop, post goods. And that’s good to

Beyond that, Well really, there isn’t. It’s 95% classified ads.

 

 

And yes, you bet I hope I piss people off. Piss them off to do something about this site. OR it will become a waist of bandwidth.

. Don’t ask me for ideas. That’s not my job. I’m not a board member. Oh yea.I think I scared one off tonight in chat. Yes there where 2 of us, 3 for a moment.

 

NOW CHAT that’s a friggin joke. TAKE THE DAMM THING OFF THE CALENDER. Who the hell are you kidding???????? I didn’t join in the winter. That certainly wasn’t how this site was presented to me!!!!!” Come join in”

 

AND ANOTHER THING. We All ( whoever still looks here) read about the shop with the horrible treatment and conditions they but there animals through. I went in there years ago. I almost puked. But hell no PMs only, it’s a sponsor. What the hell happened with that?? Board meeting, did it just die, get buried, it’s none of us little peoples business!! It’s a sponsor, don’t want to loose them. Bull Crap WHAT????????

Or will that be a topic of discussion on a Monday night?

 

Now if 75 people did go to the BBQ, and my understanding was, it was less than half. Well hell you figure it out.

[spayne]

Well, you poor little honey bunny! I like to see you frustrated. It shows that you care about the club. (clap)

 

We have our active posters and a lot of not so active ones. Not much I can do about that besides get out the bullwhip, but then everyone would just laugh at me! I think, perhaps, part of the problem with posting is many use RC or even TRT to pose their questions so they can reach a larger audience. What with the higher traffic, you're pretty much assured to get a response on either one of those boards. I very very rarely post on the other boards. I hardly ever read RC anymore, I will check to see if there's any activity on TRT in the PNWMAS forum and I tend to keep an eye on "Club-Zoa" because, well, I'm a zoa fiend.

 

I have come to see our boards as a means of all of us to stay in contact between meetings. It would be nice to see the boards utilized in educational ways, although Roger is going to have his class post on our boards and ask us questions. At least, I think that's the plan. I'll be forming a special forum for them if Roger decides to do that.

 

I'm not saying that I advocate going to RC or TRT with topics. But I can certainly understand it! Rest assured, I come to you guys first with my victories and defeats.

 

We can do lots of things with the board... someone just has to make the move. We could do our own "salt test" experiment. We don't all use the same brand and we're all constantly searching for the holy grail of salt. Just an idea. I know you have ideas... spit 'em out! (laugh)

 

The BBQ went better than expected as far as I was concerned. You have to remember, we just had that big shakeup with losing our president and vice-president. Nothing had been planned at that point... no BBQ location, nothing! We really wanted to have it in a park, but we couldn't find any openings. We were fortunate enough that John had access to that community center. Next year, we will be planning ahead. Far ahead!

 

It's rough when you go somewhere with cash in hand and you feel the customer service is sub-par. We all have our bad days. Both customers and employee/owners. Sadly, we're human. For me, if the goods are worth it, I can put up with a bit of indignity though I'm treated fine wherever I go. I probably just jinxed myself! Next time I go into C&S Sean is going to kick me in the shins and squeal "No zoanthids for you!!!" (laugh)

 

You have to do what you think is right about that. And thanks for not speaking the name of the store. This is something that should be kept to PMs. If anyone has a problem with a store, I encourage you to contact the store owner and talk to them about it. They want your money, and if they can improve their operations most of them will. Just don't expect a butt kissing and that red carpet! I'm just kidding, I know you don't expect that. (laugh)

 

As for chat... I hate chatting, that's why you'll never see me in there. Okay, never say never... but I'm just not a fan of that medium. Instant messaging, chat... bah! The LPP program here is pushing my comfort levels enough as it is! Hehe! I was tempted to jerk flash chat off the server after having those exploit scripts tacked onto it and getting our account suspended. But I know some of you really like it, so it stays. I'll just keep an eye on it. Post a reminder in the general forums about having a chat. See if that won't give you more participants!

 

As for the sponsor issue... we had an emergency meeting about it because we are concerned about the welfare of the animals. It is being worked on, I assure you. And I know, a lot of people hate the "PMs only"... but you have to realize that if these accusations are unfounded it would be slander. Plus to be perfectly honest, I believe topics, such as that, which are potentially inflammatory in nature should be kept to private messaging. Why? Because, quite honestly, if we're constantly bickering who in the heck is going to want to be part of our club and participate on the boards? I know when things were getting ugly last year I questioned why I was staying with the club. But I stuck with it and look at me now. Secretary/Forum Admin... aka SUCKER!

 

I don't know if I helped or not or just managed to tick you off even more! If I failed, you can give me a black eye the next time you see me if you want! (naner)

 

And just because you're not on the board or not an officer doesn't mean you don't have a voice with this club. We have an open door policy. We're just going through some growing pains, so sometimes things do not go as smoothly as they should. Every year we get a little better. We all just need to be a little patient... and if you have suggestions, then say them!

 

BTW, Blaine... you're good for the rest of the year. No more noise outta you! Just kidding! (naughty)

[Michael7979]

Very nicely said, Stacy.

 

Blaine, I will take responsibility for not meeting more people at the BBQ as I was busy lining things up. My fault as maybe I should have been more prepared for what went on.

 

I agree that not every member will get along or like every sponsor, but we are very lucky to have several good LFS to choose from and find our own comfort levels.

 

I try to make chat when I can but Monday night is (MY) Sunday night and I have things that I get done before bed/going to work the next day. Not to mention kids homework now also. I'll say this I'll try even harded to make it in there for a little while more often.

 

PM a BOD with your ideas if you have them or better yet just start a thread about it!

 

Hope you were having an off day and you really aren't that upset with the club.

[R-3]

No direspect is meant to anyone in this thread I am just stating my opinions. I really dont think me being a officer I should hide my feelings.

 

If you dont like a store dont go there. Plain and simple. We have so many different LFS's in this area that it is mind boggling why people go to the same ones that they dont like. There has to be at least one or two that you will enjoy. If there is something you really want at that particular store that no one else has well it seems like ya gotta take it in the shorts. Stores have there own customer service policies and you just have to live with them. We cant tell a store that they cant be a sponsor because they dont kiss MEMBERS A$$. Man this has been beat to death.

 

As for the BBQ. I think it went very well. I dont know everyone either but I made it a point to try to talk to them or at least let them know who I was. Even though I didnt get to see Randys presentation (ill catch on video when Miles gets it up) I really dont think it went on that long. You gotta realize that he flew in specifically to talk to our group and thats it. He could have sat up there for two hours for all I care. BTW- Get ready for someone like Borneman or Calfo. You will be in your seats for a while.

 

It is summer and people have other things to do. That is a good excuse. I have a little 2 1/2 year old girl that I like to take camping, fishing, boating, to the dunes, swimming, water parks, etc... People really take the summers off on their tanks. Its just the way it is. Wait till October.

 

As for the board and our meetings we have them every month before the meeting and also have time slotted for a emergency meeting. The sponsor store that was in question has been talked to and dealt with.

 

Also I post on all sites. RC, TRT, RF, NR, and Reef.ORG. I tend to do most of my posting here though. I really dont see a problem with posting somewhere else. THere is a wealth (HUGE WEALTH) of knowledge outside of our club. Clubs that have been established longer than I have been born. We are not tied for life to this site. If I feel like posting on RC because I know I will get a lot of answers (different opinions) then I should. I really dont get this arguement. How many more posts are suppose to be on this site?

 

One last thing- This is a club. A club that had a $20 or $30 fee per year. About the same price as a

a cheap dinner for two. Treat it like that. Dont expect the world of it. We are a new club. We just introduced fees last year. Give us some time to iron things out a bit. No of us are perfect and have all the answers. That is why we reach out to other sites, other clubs and still ask more questions. Later Ryan

[Chief]

Point taken Blaine. I understand your frustration. I know I haven't been as active lately and I could give you a bunch of excuses, but they would just be excuses. I like Stacy's idea of a salt study. I also thought we could do a sand trade in the future to help each other out with bio-diversity. Now that school is in session, maybe Roger can get the coral identification threads going. We were going to have the kids post pics of corals and ask questions about the animals to learn about reef organisms. Or we could post pics and have them do the research. Along the same lines as the salt study, I would like to do a study on different test kits. Some are good, and some are downright horrible. Nothing is worse than buying a bad test kit.

 

As for the BBQ, I'm sorry I couldn't get around more. I didn't stop running around much. I was lucky to get something to eat. I started my day at 6am and didn't get home unil 8pm. The weather was unfortunate. A nice 80 degree day would have been great. The next gathering we have, the Christmas Party, will be held at the Milwaukie Center. We will probably go back to the Milwaukie Center in February to hear Borneman speak. I really wanted to have the BBQ at a park with a community center, but time was our enemy. We really did the best we could with the time we had. We are starting to look for next years BBQ location now.

 

Please... give us your suggestions. As for more educational activities planned. We have a behind the scenes tour of the Newport Aquarium, tour of the Hatfield Marine Science Center, Borneman speaking in February, DIY rock building, possibly another speaker next year, and the SOLV beach cleanup this Saturday. You're right though, we need to have more educational discussions on the boards. I will do my part to start some threads.

 

I really do thank you for your input.

 

Jay

[mister crabs]

I have been tryingto steer more nw reefers that i run into on RC and other sites into here hoping to perk up the knowledge and idea base a bit. Maybe we can get a spot in RC's club section? I am running into manypeople here in central oregon who didnt know that this group even existed and have since checked it out. I think this is a great site especially for the classified section (even if hardley anythging new in there) because that way i can find equipment without looking at offerings in Florida or some other far off place i dont want to pay shipping from. And since I live in the land of NO LFS the sponsor sites WOULD be more helpful if they perhaps had a listing of current livestock or maybe what brands or models of equipment they sell? I would much rather just drop by when im in the valley and pick something up i need rather than buyit online but i never know what these stores have. I know i can call but looking quickly online is SOOOO much faster for me. I really dont see anything wrong with the chat but I woulxd rather use AIM or MSN messenger personally. just my .02

[mister crabs]

some side by side tests of different lighting setups or test kits and such would be great....good idea jay!

[Chief]

I just thought of something else to bring more people in. This is something we had in the past. I could make a small PNWMAS banner that you could put in your signature line when posting in other forums. That way we could get our name out there, and provide a link back to our site. I'll get to work on it right away.

 

 

Jay

[nu2reef-n]

That's a great idea.

[Chief]

Here it is!!!!!!!!!

 

What do you think?

 

Jay

[R-3]

We need to make it linkable Jay!! That would be sweet. Later Ryan

[Reefin']

what would be sweet if the banner had Salem and Eugene on it.....or at least Albany:D

[Chief]

We need to make it linkable Jay!! That would be sweet. Later Ryan

 

I can make it linkable here, but most sites, like TRT, won't allow HTML in their sigs. If you have a site that allows HTML in the sig let me know and I will make it linkable.

 

Jay

[R-3]

Ohh yeah I forgot about that. Nevermind Jay my bad. Later Ryan

[Chief]

what would be sweet if the banner had Salem and Eugene on it.....or at least Albany:D

 

 

Albany...

 

Where's Albany? (scratch)

 

Jay (innocent)

[Reefin']

HA ha ha....pretty funny....lol

[Chief]

HA ha ha....pretty funny....lol

 

 

Like I can talk. Anybody know where Creswell is? Just a wide spot in the road. (laugh)

 

Jay

[ringwurm]

I guess I will chime in here.

 

I was very excited to join the club last year but soon realized it was not what I expected. The meetings are just an excuse to goto a fish store to get things at a discount. I have not been to a meeting that was actually worth my time (besides the livestock). Nothing is discussed that the average member cares about and definately nothing educational. I would actually be embarrased to bring a visitor to one of our meetings because nothing happens at them.

 

I almost didn't renew my membership but decided to for the LFS discounts and the aquarium trip. I guess you have to take it for what its worth unless you are willing to put out the effort to change things at the top level.

 

My suggestions for meetints would be:

Have a scheduled meeting. Have a start, middle and end.

Have planned topics.

Have members give talks.

Have sponsors give talks.

Explain a product.

Talk about a fish or coral.

If you provide a meeting agenda people can be prepared to speak or ask questions.

 

------

My suggestions for the club in general:

The club should have several goals. Long term and short term. Make the club have a purpose.

short terms:

- have the club be a source of something to the hobby.

- propogation of a certain coral that we would make available to other clubs

- breeding of fish or invert

 

Long Term:

How to help the hobby via knowledge xfer.

Have specific goal for people to work towards.

 

 

Greg

[CCR]

hmmmm blocked?

 

Staci, you had it right.

 

 

I want to be very clear. Yes, it was a long day. No, I wouldn't have changed a thing. Understand, this was not directed at any person. Understand, I do like the people I have met. As far as different LSF. You bet, It's my choice where I go, Like and don't. Still. The point was missed.

 

I looked at TRT this am. I saw several members there, that haven’t posted for a long time here. Everyone can do whatever they like. I understand that very well.

I also don’t want to beat a dead horse either. I mean really, what fun is that?

 

I like to see the LSF post there goods. But that is sales. We need to be more than that. Information IS the name of the game. I would like to see the shops cooperate between each other as to what works and don’t. (Yes, asking for the moon and stars, with the reasoning of it’s what they do, so we reefers can have better information, less failure, better tanks, environment for our pets)

 

The way it is now, is on the edge of competition. We know it is competition. I for one, don’t want to see it turn into sponsor against sponsor, and using this site for that. The entire health of the”club” would go down the toilet.

Is it close to that!, closer than you think. Is it close to that!, closer than you think

No, that was not a mistake to say it twice. A hard fact that needed to be repeated.

 

Oh sure, there would be great deals, but again, if that’s what it is. Then where nothing more than a classified ad board.

 

Maybe I have missed something here, I hope I have. I haven’t seen anything from the shops as to educational. Have I beaten this to death yet? Will it do any good? I hope so.

[nu2reef-n]

I agree with CCR and ringwurm. The officers of this club have made a committment to the members. I know it takes time, and it's summer and all.

I like ringwurm's suggestions, and CCR has some good ideas also. Maybe now is the time for all of the members to post their opinions.

We need to focus our energy, instead of bickering constantly. This is more of a circus than a club. Every other month, there's some new drama unfolding here.

Why can't we all just get along.

[spayne]

We need to focus our energy, instead of bickering constantly. This is more of a circus than a club. Every other month, there's some new drama unfolding here.

Why can't we all just get along.

This is why I seriously thought about quitting the club last year. I was seriously getting tired of the bickering. He stole this... you're an idiot... you will do what I say... I don't care about your opinion. I could go on and on for hours.

 

And I hear you on the meetings. Imagine driving all the way to Portland from Creswell for a gab fest? That's a good couple hours. Sure, we had the added benefit of going to the other awesome LFS in the PDX area... but the meetings were a bit of a joke. Since Jay has taken office the June meetings was at Advanced and Ryan gave a talk on water chemistry. We were slated to have a topic at the July meeting at FantaSeas, but there was a bit of a shakeup with the speaker at the last minute. August, BBQ with Randy Reed. September... SOLV beach clean up, because not only do we need to educate, we need to be proactive in caring for the oceans. We need to give back for what we take as much as possible. Every meeting from here on out is supposed to have a topic.

 

In fact, I look at PNWMAS as an entirely new club. I know, maybe that's wrong... but if you get right down to it our NPO was dissolved (without our knowledge) and we're lucky that dedicated individuals scrambled and worked their butts off to keep it going. The club took a MASSIVE hit just a few short months ago. MASSIVE!!! We lost our President, Vice President and our Forum Admin said he was retiring. Not to mention our President was also our Web Master... so that was a double whammy right there.

 

Our hands have been FULL. We had to figure out what to do with the changing of the guard, figure out the BBQ which had not been planned yet... deal with getting club property from individuals, changing PayPal addresses for security, starting a business bank account with US Bank, working on getting the information with our club filing in Oregon changed from Ryan to Jay (and we're still waiting on this), changing all of the web servers and such to PNWMAS, changing the front page to remove Ryan's intellectual property... I mean, this list goes on and on and on. Oh, and Mike scheduled BORNEMAN to speak! We've been burning the candle at both ends just getting all this technical stuff changed over. Once that's all done, then we'll work on the NPO and getting the by-laws up.

 

Since I came into office, I have tried to make myself available to everyone. And not just officers and BOD. This is OUR club, guys! Not just one person, or a select group of people. You know that old saying, "It takes a village to raise a child"? Well, our child is the club and it's going to take all of us together... working together... to make this a great place. When I worked, I knew the fastest way to get my way was to go to the "boss" with the problem and the solution. Not that I'm saying we're bosses by any means, but you get my drift I think. We want to hear your ideas and solutions! If you want a topic discussed at a meeting, tell us! Heck, if you're well versed in a subject, offer to speak about it.

 

We all need to take a breath and be a little patient. Try to help each other out. Honestly, I want to see this club become something way bigger than it is now. I want to see the club working with lots of schools, putting tanks in classrooms. Educating youth is key. If you get them while they're young, they'll protect what they love. I want to see big speakers come in once or twice a year and open it up to the public so educate the masses. I'd like to see us have booths at fairs and events where we can talk to people about our hobby as well as conservation and caring for the ecosystem. I want to see us assist and support the Newport Aquarium and Hatfield. I'm not in this club for the frag trades and discounts. I'm looking at the big picture. The future big picture.

 

I totally get the frustration though. I've had it as a club member... and now as an officer. Now, I'm not trying to make anyone mad... but look at it from my side. The officers and BOD spend so much of their free time on this club, and we don't get compensated for it, just to hear "It's not good enough!" Sorry, but we're really trying! (sad)

 

I'm not complaining. And I'm not angry. In fact, I'm thankful that Blaine started this thread because we do need to know where the problems are and we ALL need to come up with a solution. Just remember, everyone... most of the BOD and officers have full time jobs. For example, Jay works 50-60 hours a week, so sometimes he can't get to something right away.

 

So again, that was my vision of the future of the club (which probably isn't shared by anyone else!), discussing the changes implemented in this term of the club, what the officers and BOD do for you and I'M NOT ANGRY! It's so easy to misread posts. I'm just trying to be helpful. I swear! No animosity here!

[mister crabs]

well said......people do have jobs and iam new to this forum and hadnt realized it had just changed hands so to speak. With that said id say things are going nicely and that planning events such as bbq's and beach cleanups takes a lot of time and effort that is not monetarily rewarded.

 

I look at other forums such as Reef central and while i do see alot more people on there posting away it seems to be the same questions and topics getting re-hashed over and over and over and over.

At least here i dont have to read the same questions such as "which light for my 10 gllon?", and "how many fish can i fit in my tank?", asked by ten different people every day.

[CCR]

I need to add this.I have had a lot of PMs in regart to a comment I made. When I said sand box. This is it. I don't want Mr.-s and other teachers bringing the youngins here and reading this, as I know there parents will also. and see that there was an issue. So PLEASE STOP THE PMs asking me. It pisses me off that after all this. to be asked something so stupid. Thank You for your understanding. Let's get to work and be better than all the rest. Just a little faster than baby steps PLEASE

[Michael7979]

All good points.

 

I personally would like to see the club, (as a long term goal), be able to have a convention center scheduled....and then get local and national vendors to come in a show their wares. We possibly could do this with PSAS. Hold it in Vancouver/Portland and give away booth space for free if they would come and show off the new stuff or popular older stuff. And maybe just maybe it would become something grand like a smaller version of MACNA.

 

Short term I would like to see more people who hold meetings give a small lecture on a coral, fish, or something like that. So a meeting would be brought to order, news would be announced, lecture/talk given, meeting adjourned, and then chit chat and trades can be done. I think thats very simple and meetings might become shorter and more to the point.

[Twitterbait]

Hello all...

 

As a member who doesn't post very often i do have a few things to say. Granted I have an excuse because I mod on another forum and that takes my time.

 

I have had my issues with LFS's, the club, and other things but in the end I don't let it bug me. there are other resources and I always know i can come here for the local scene. It really comes down to what you want out of the club and what your willing to do for it. I volunteer to mod and it kills me when i look at the clock and realize that i have been working for 4 hours trying to help resolve a problem. On that note we need to understand that our club leaders have time constraints as well and they have to try to work within what their spouses will allow. I thank them for their desire and willingness to serve.

 

So what to do? I have a few simple rules that i go by that i would like to share...

 

1. If you want something done... Get it started by yourself.-- If you have an idea that is complicated make sure you are willing to get it rolling so the club leaders aren't left trying to get it going.

 

2. If you don't like an LFS, don't go there and don't recommend them to anyone. If they are really bad to the level of animal abuse then report them to the ASPCA for quick legal resolution.

 

3. Spread the love. if you have a problem or question post it here and on some of the other sites. then when you get info, refer to it on the other sites as well. that will let people know that there is a local and a national source for help and information.

 

4. BE NICE!!! ... Unless you know the person is going to disappear soon then you should always be on your best behavior... you never know when you may meet them in a dark alley. I have seen too much crap about disagreements, fighting and such. There are times that i see stuff that i know i can't reply back nicely about so I JUST DON'T REPLY. Better to remain silent and let someone learn the hard way then start a fight and lose a potential friend (I have done this too many times). When you reply to a post make sure to read over it a few times before hitting the button. you may want to re-word it in the end.

 

5. BE NICE #2-- When you read a post that burns your hide... read it a few times and try to always assume that the author means the best and may be upset or confused. Then if you reply make your reply as educational as possible. no problems then.

 

Life is too short and this hobby can take a lot out of you especially when you've been up for 48 hours trying to keep the tank from dying (i had to do this recently... and failed). Be nice, contribute some of your own time to the club, and enjoy each others company and the rest will either fall into place or fall away. either way it's all good.