Jay Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 Hello everyone: I was thinking about how I could vacume my sand without loseing my water so I can take my time. I was thinking why cant I just vacume the sand into my sump through the filter sock to catch the poo that I want gone. This way all the water stays and the junk can be taken out with the filter sock. Has anyone done this yet? I know I dont want to disturb to much of the sand all at once but mabey half one week then half the next week. Whats your thoughts? Would be a good way to eraticate cyano I would think. Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakkzz Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 I'm not an expert on this stuff but I vacuum and always loose so much water but is a great time to vaccum when doing your water change anyways. I always have a lot of junk and think that stirring the sand an putting that water back in would put in a bunch of the bad stuff your sand was filtering out back into the tank. That , I don't think, would be removed throught the sump and sock. I wouldn't think it would be worth the increased levels you could experience. Is there a reason you are worried about saving that water? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 Why are you vacuuming the sand in the first place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewie Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 If your tank is drilled for an overflow then it won't be a problem volume wise. If you have a HOB overflow, make sure it doesn't lose siphon due to less water moving through the U tube. Other than that, I'd start out with 10% at a time as to not shock the system, assuming you don't have a DSB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Snorkelwasp Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 i have done something similar to vaccuum up hair algae/cyanobacteria...i used a canister filter..vaccuums at about the same pace and water goes throuh the filter and comes out clean...you can pack the baskets with filter floss...you may have to change it frequently during the job but you can take your time and save water....probably harder to do with sand but maybe with a siphon tube at the end it may work well...ill experiment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakkzz Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 Why are you vacuuming the sand in the first place? Should you not vacuum the sand from time to time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 I don't. Still don't understand why unless you are siphoning out cyano. And any sand you vacuumed would only be a byproduct of siphoning the cyano. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakkzz Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Not to take over the post but now I'm curious? I don't "vacuum" every time I change the water but the times I have the water that comes out doesn't have sand in it but it is a thickly murky water. I have a 2-3 inch sand bed (depending on where you measure). I have always done this with freshwater to remove the tiny debris between the rocks and started doing this when I got into saltwater. Is this something I should not be doing. Am I harming it by doing such? Thank you for the information! The sand when stirred can have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael7979 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 If it is A SSB then I do not see a problem as long as it is done in small amounts. I WOULD NEVER VACCUM A DSB! I know Steve Weast use to vaccum out a little sand every once in awhile so he could replace it with new sand. Increasing the sands 'buffing' capacity, ( I assume), was the main goal. But also to keep it clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krux Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Nutrients that are in your sand bed will be sucked up but will be too small to be caught by the filter sock, and thus will go right back into the water. You will get particulate matter, but in the long run will likely only feed the cyano cycle as these become unlocked and available as a food source again. Combine your sand vacuum day with water change day and you will have no problems. Water is cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael7979 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Not to take over the post but now I'm curious? I don't "vacuum" every time I change the water but the times I have the water that comes out doesn't have sand in it but it is a thickly murky water. I have a 2-3 inch sand bed (depending on where you measure). I have always done this with freshwater to remove the tiny debris between the rocks and started doing this when I got into saltwater. Is this something I should not be doing. Am I harming it by doing such? Thank you for the information! The sand when stirred can have If you vaccum up to much you can do more harm to the benefical bacteria bed, which can cause even larger problems. I use to vaccum along the glass so the sand always looked better but never really vaccumed in middle areas of the tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 I don't. Still don't understand why unless you are siphoning out cyano. And any sand you vacuumed would only be a byproduct of siphoning the cyano. Ive had this system for a good long time and have not vacumed it. Comming up on 3 years and I am haveing some algae problems and want to see if I can extract some of the source of phosphates from the substrate. I dont have any sand stirring stars and the nasso snails have all went to the mantis shrimp. I have GFO and carbon and am in the process of fixing a skimmer problem. I am just trying to step up the maintenance because I had gotten a little lazy with the maintenance. I think I need a new needle wheel pump for my skimmer....grumble grumble. Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 I was just throwing out a idea.....thats all. I have been at this long enough to know that I need to do something about the crud in my sand. I can see it in some places near the rock and in the corners. Plenty of current with my powerheads and returnes but not quite enough to keep everything in suspension to be sent down the overflow to my sump. I will just do a 50% water change next time and vacume out 55 gallons worth. That should give me plenty of time to clean the crud : ) Jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smann Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I have a deep sand bed with a plenum and like everything else you do need to do maintenance, over time you will build up "stuff" uasually near the top and you can exhaust its usefullness so it will need to be replaced. This should be done in small amounts in different areas and regularly with other cleaning, there are several good articles on this at WWM. I have several critters that live off that sand on the top, tigertails,nassarius snails,sand stars,gobys so it must be kept up but not to the point where it wont provide food for them. Stirring the sandbed is the first and best way to keep it up, weekly or more in different areas and deep. do it at night right before lights out and it will be clear in the morning. I also remove just the top layer as you described, I combine 2 filter socks in my fuge and suck out just the sand around rock with algae,dead or dirty looking sand and then add new sand by digging small areas and adding new sand, never cover old sand with new then stir it in. Since I dont do water changes i also use that method to do light vacumning, just about the top 1" or so and just small areas at a time, no more than 1/4 of the tank bed and again I'm doing more stirring than real vacumning just lifting and moving the sand around good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Ive had this system for a good long time and have not vacumed it. Comming up on 3 years and I am haveing some algae problems and want to see if I can extract some of the source of phosphates from the substrate. I dont have any sand stirring stars and the nasso snails have all went to the mantis shrimp. I have GFO and carbon and am in the process of fixing a skimmer problem. I am just trying to step up the maintenance because I had gotten a little lazy with the maintenance. I think I need a new needle wheel pump for my skimmer....grumble grumble. Jay Gotcha. Yah i would still siphon it out along with water when you do a WC. Are you planning to replace the sand or go BB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impur Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Hey you might check this thread out. Just what you are looking for i think. http://www.pnwmas.org/forums/showthread.php?p=103676#post103676 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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