TheClark Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 Did you vertex controller users see the news!!? Classy on Vertex's part, I am impressed Quote By now I’m sure there’s a cohort of Cerebra early adopters who are beginning to fume at the thought of their controller becoming obsolete but we’ve been told that they will all be upgraded to the Cerebra 2 free of charge. https://reefbuilders.com/2017/10/03/vertex-cerebra-2-will-unveiled-reefapalooza-weekend/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodus Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 Yeah remember when I asked the question a couple months back as to what happened to the controller, well after some searching I found the company has been promising this for months, and even stated as early as June this year they were supposed to have it. Glad they are making advancements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertareef Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 14 hours ago, Exodus said: Yeah remember when I asked the question a couple months back as to what happened to the controller, well after some searching I found the company has been promising this for months, and even stated as early as June this year they were supposed to have it. Glad they are making advancements. I do recall this and was curious myself. I found the comment on that linked announcement pretty interesting so copied it below just in case this thread caught some folks attention who might be considering it... Raises some interesting points. Aquarium controllers don't require the sheer amount of processing power apps running on our cell phones do. That's one piece of equipment I have no issues with upgrading every 5-10 years since it ensures a stable platform, given what is at stake. An aquarium controller should be designed to fulfill a number of relevant tasks and to do it efficiently. While it should be flexible, it shouldn't be a swiss army knife. While I am a big supporter of open source and development, I don't think Vertex has a big enough community of programmers to keep up with the potential security risks involved in user-end apps. Open-source software is kept secure through large oversight of a community. I just don't see that happening in this small nitch. Android is a rapidly evolving platform that will require constant updating on Vertex's end. So they'll have to keep up with security updates and bug fixes. And given their past track record with the "beta" controller, I am quite skeptical. I think the Apex or Profilux code base can be more easily maintained by a small team since it isn't a full blown operating system like Android. You can argue that the Reef Angel is a model for this type of platform, but it has a way smaller user base than the most popular controllers, and it's driven by a passionate DIY community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zondebok Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 24 minutes ago, albertareef said: Open-source software is kept secure through large oversight of a community. I just don't see that happening in this small nitch. 24 minutes ago, albertareef said: You can argue that the Reef Angel is a model for this type of platform, but it has a way smaller user base than the most popular controllers, and it's driven by a passionate DIY community. Weird logic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertareef Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 41 minutes ago, zondebok said: Weird logic... There is a certain degree of contradiction there but I can see what the commenter is driving at. Then again... I may just be misreading their intent. Wouldn't be the first time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 Interesting! If I had to make one of these, 100% I would leverage a platform such as Android. APEX was just early to the party and didn't have that option back in the day. There are so many things that Android just does out of the box. They don't need to be reinvented. Software engineers refer to it as the DRY principle (Do Not Repeat Yourself). Instead the controller makers can focus on the controller rather than responding to clicks, resizing things, interfacing with touch screen at a low level etc... That would not be DRY. Instead, it allows them to work at a higher level of abstractions, solving problems in their domain rather than generic problems common to interfacing with hardware. its the same reason we don't program in binary anymore or with punch cards Now choosing Android or another hardware OS does not guarantee success, but in my book it was a very good call and an excellent building block. I am a die hard APEX fan though But lover of technology in general... Heck, if I had to do one of these from scratch, it would be based openHab for sensors integration with node red to run the rules. Running on a linux box (vs Android). All home automation sensors could come into play and it would tap the much larger market of home automation to reduce costs... Fun stuff and good to see growth here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertareef Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 38 minutes ago, TheClark said: Interesting! If I had to make one of these, 100% I would leverage a platform such as Android. APEX was just early to the party and didn't have that option back in the day. Yep. There are so many things that Android just does out of the box. They don't need to be reinvented. Software engineers refer to it as the DRY principle (Do Not Repeat Yourself). Instead the controller makers can focus on the controller rather than responding to clicks, resizing things, interfacing with touch screen at a low level etc... Makes perfect sense. That would not be DRY. Instead, it allows them to work at a higher level of abstractions, solving problems in their domain rather than generic problems common to interfacing with hardware. its the same reason we don't program in binary anymore or with punch cards Hey now, I have fond memories of punch cards! Now choosing Android or another hardware OS does not guarantee success, but in my book it was a very good call and an excellent building block. True (with caveat below) I am a die hard APEX fan though But lover of technology in general... Big surprise there Heck, if I had to do one of these from scratch, it would be based openHab for sensors integration with node red to run the rules. Running on a linux box (vs Android). All home automation sensors could come into play and it would tap the much larger market of home automation to reduce costs... I like this idea... sign me up! Fun stuff and good to see growth here... Caveat - I think the "devil in the details" here might be how the handoff/integration between any custom code/functions and the general OS is handled. Andriod evolves quickly (generally a good thing) and is driven by use cases that are probably far outside this particular application so how stable will those touch points be and will the team be able to keep on top of that? (I think this might underly the original commentators unease although it is broached as a security issue there vs. basic functionality). Anyway, might be a moot point if the controller itself isn't subjected to frequent versioning (Android) updates (likely controlled by Vertex?). If they can successful address this potential issue that yeah, it all makes too much sense not to try. Forgive me if I worded this badly but hopefully the idea gets across. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zondebok Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 There is a pretty good effort going on to build a raspberry pi based controller. I think the biggest issue is that designing probes to be accurate and not interfere with each other is somewhat complicated and expensive. This is the biggest thing that APEX has going for it, IMO. I do wish I could use much more complex logic on the apex, but I can generally do whatever I need to do. The real downside is that you can only use pretty rudimentary 3rd party hardware (no analog signal, just an on/off from the breakout box). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zondebok Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 1 minute ago, albertareef said: Caveat - I think the "devil in the details" here might be how the handoff/integration between any custom code/functions and the general OS is handled. Andriod evolves quickly (generally a good thing) and is driven by use cases that are probably far outside this particular application so how stable will those touch points be and will the team be able to keep on top of that? (I think this might underly the original commentators unease although it is broached as a security issue there vs. basic functionality). Anyway, might be a moot point if the controller itself isn't subjected to frequent versioning (Android) updates (likely controlled by Vertex?). If they can successful address this potential issue that yeah, it all makes too much sense not to try. Forgive me if I worded this badly but hopefully the idea gets across. I think this part is not a huge deal. There are still people using android phones that are 2+ versions behind. It's easy to target those platforms, and the tools will keep you within the frameworks that work on that version. There would be no huge reason to constantly upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertareef Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 3 minutes ago, zondebok said: I think this part is not a huge deal. There are still people using android phones that are 2+ versions behind. It's easy to target those platforms, and the tools will keep you within the frameworks that work on that version. There would be no huge reason to constantly upgrade. That is what I would hope... just not sure what their vision is for the platform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClark Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 APEX really does have allot going for them. #gottadayjobalready I am surprised they didn't just use a linux distro though... allot more freedom. But the decision to pick a platform and leverage it? To me, that's 100% legit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zondebok Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 APEX really does have allot going for them. #gottadayjobalready [emoji4] I am surprised they didn't just use a linux distro though... allot more freedom. But the decision to pick a platform and leverage it? To me, that's 100% legit... Are you sure they don't? It seems doubtful that they literally wrote an OS for their controllers.Would be nice if it was a little more open though. Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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