Jan Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Hi all, I am brand new to this hobby. I have a 10-day old 40 gallon aquarium with 40 lbs of live, allegedly cured rock in it. Does it always have to take ~a month to cycle a new aquarium, even with cured rock in it? Am I waiting for proliferation of the right bacteria throughout my tank water, and it just takes that long? What if I think my rock is cured but its really not? (The lfs I bought it from said it was cured.) Second question, the salesguy at the lfs said I should use tap water to set up my tank, and that RO/DI water was a waste of money because our water is "so clean here." So I did. Have I just guaranteed the destruction of my future fauna?? (scratch) I live in Lynnwood, WA, for what it's worth. Last question...I'm struggling to design a sump/skimmer/refugium system. Is there anyone on here who especially loves giving advice on this subject? I'd like to bend your ear... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Hi all, I am brand new to this hobby. I have a 10-day old 40 gallon aquarium with 40 lbs of live, allegedly cured rock in it. Does it always have to take ~a month to cycle a new aquarium, even with cured rock in it? Am I waiting for proliferation of the right bacteria throughout my tank water, and it just takes that long? What if I think my rock is cured but its really not? (The lfs I bought it from said it was cured.) Second question, the salesguy at the lfs said I should use tap water to set up my tank, and that RO/DI water was a waste of money because our water is "so clean here." So I did. Have I just guaranteed the destruction of my future fauna?? (scratch) I live in Lynnwood, WA, for what it's worth. Last question...I'm struggling to design a sump/skimmer/refugium system. Is there anyone on here who especially loves giving advice on this subject? I'd like to bend your ear... First welcome to the boards...I can not believe what LFS will tell people. RO/DI is one of the best things you can put in your tank...You have not screwed your tank for ever, we do have pretty clean water here, but not nearly as clean as RO/DI. So I would suggest investing in a unit...they can be had for a reasonable price. As for water cycling...it all depends. If you got it from the same LFS as the one that told you not to use RO/DI, then I would not trust it to much. As for tank cycle, there is no set point at all...You just need to watch your levels until everything is at zero, then you are good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanz Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 (welcome) (To) (P) (N) (W) (M) (A) (S) Patience is key in this hobby! Just keep testing until nitrates, nitrites, ammonia is at 0. Tap was fine for me for like a year, corals "survived" but didn't really thrive. So yeah, RO/DI is the way to go. Units are fairly cheap nowadays. Search "sump" on this website and you'll see some threads about what people have done. Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Thankyou, RG. My ammonia, NO2 & NO3 were all at zero after 1 week. I posted on saltwaterfish.com with this info, and most people thought that it wasn't possible for the tank to have cycled in 1 week. Someone suggested spiking the tank with a bit of raw seafood and watching the levels. I did that, and after 48 hours my amonia was at ~.1, nitrite at 0, nitrate at 5. So the raw seafood did something. Sounds like you believe that after the levels come back to zero, I can bring in a few live things. (I am very anxious...I'm sure you've never seen that before. (laugh) ) And thanks for the welcomes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefgeek84 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Thankyou, RG. My ammonia, NO2 & NO3 were all at zero after 1 week. I posted on saltwaterfish.com with this info, and most people thought that it wasn't possible for the tank to have cycled in 1 week. Someone suggested spiking the tank with a bit of raw seafood and watching the levels. I did that, and after 48 hours my amonia was at ~.1, nitrite at 0, nitrate at 5. So the raw seafood did something. Sounds like you believe that after the levels come back to zero, I can bring in a few live things. (I am very anxious...I'm sure you've never seen that before. (laugh) ) And thanks for the welcomes! Well, New water will not start to cycle after a week...it takes longer...in the next week or two levels will come up more. Check once a week and wait until a week or two with all levels at zero. Like vanz, said patience is the best thing to have in this hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyles Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Patience, I know its hard... so so hard. It will be worth your time, trust me. I would wait a week, dont change water and keep an eye out on your levels. When you put in the shrimp you boosted the waste, the system will now have good bacteria to fight the waste. This is what happens when it cycles, the good bacteria fight/eta the wastes and you add fish and its adds to the process, so even then you have to go SLOW. Or you will easily surpass your stability of good bacteria and cause excess waste do to the fact your bacterias cant keep up. OH, and WELCOME hope you like it here... lots of good people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Thanks, everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronjunior Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Just remember that the ammonia will spike, then start to fall, and next step is nitrites to spike, then fall.....turns into nitrate which is the goal. The first 2 are very toxic, nitrates not as much. I wouldn't say everybody has undetectable nitrates....but it is possible. Here's a good article to read. http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/bionitrogencycle/a/aa073199.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holly Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 (waving) Welcome!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DChemist Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 What are you planning to put in this aquarium? Just fish? Or corals and other invertebrates? This information will help folks better address the water chemistry, equipment, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Here are my thoughts on that, and purchases so far: I have a 40 gallon acrylic tank, not drilled. Filled with seawater & 40 lbs of LR. Dimensions of tank are 36" long x 15" deep x ?? " high The stand is a low dresser top (drawers but no cabinet underneath). I want to have a sump w/refugium but that setup has to fit behind the display tank on the dresser. I have ~13" of space between main tank and the wall. I bought a used skimmer & pump off Ebay: ETSS Evolution 500 Downdraft Protein Skimmer Skimmer footprint 7" x 7" x 22" Supreme Mag-Drive 9.5 Water Pump Flow Rate: 950 GPH Maximum Flow with a 14` Shut-Off Power Consumption: 93 Watts Pump Size (L x W x H): 5.0" x 3.0" x 5.5" Then I bought a refugium kit, it can be assembled a variety of ways. · 30"L x 12"W x 14"H · two standard pvc 1" bulkheads · can be used with internal or external pump · 400 - 500 GPH recommended water flow rate · rated for up to 250 gallon system Last I bought an E-sump overflow box U-tube style 6"x3.25"x10" and rated to 75 gallon tank size. That's all I know about it. My goal for the main tank is to have a "marginal reef" if I understand that term correctly--I want mostly corals & inverts of the hardier type, plus some fish. My goal for the refugium is 1) to create food for the corals, and 2) to reduce nitrites and nuisance algae in the main tank. I want to store my skimmer & pump in there as well. Some questions I have in mind: 1. What is the correct strength of return pump to buy (should I get the same gph rating as the skimmer pump? --or one rated to 500 gph per sump specifics?). If I want 20x total flow for my main tank, is 500 gph enough through-put for the type of inhabitants I've described and the tank size? 2. Did I buy a big enough overflow box? 3. Are there any other parts I've neglected to buy that I need? (I don't know if I want to propagate anything at this time...) 4. Do you see any major problems with the parts I have purchased? 5. The skimmer comes with bio-balls; if I replace those with LR rubble will the skimmer still work as well? Or should I stick with the bio-balls? 6. How would (and should) I make the return flow into the main tank the "chaotic" type flow direction? (I have two other powerheads in the tank that are uni-directional, flowing in a circle. One placed med-high, the other low. I'm fine with leaving these in the main tank.) 7. How much wattage do I need on the light for the refugium? Any special spectrum needed for growing algae and 'pods? Thanks again-- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mister crabs Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 you want to match your return as closely as possible to what your skimmer can process. total water turnover is really overrated since if your skimmer can only process, say, 300 gallons an hour and your putting 600 gallons of water thru the sump then you are putting 300 gallons of unprocessed water back into the display. Bio balls are only good at trapping nitrates. a good bit of LR rubble and some chaeto or other macroalgae will do wonders in the fuge. Im not real familiar with that style of skimmer....it comes with bio balls in it? if the overflow box has a 1" hole then its capable of 1000 gallons per hour (someone correct me if im wrong?). one of the screw in type pc bulbs from home depot or walmart in a clamp on style lamp is fine for the fuge. to get chaotic flow you can split your return line with a "Y" either in PVC or get LOC-LINE with two duckbill nozzles. maybe look at getting a hydor-flo rotating adapters to put on your powerheads for random flow. what kind of lighting are you using over your main display? I'd reccomed eitehr a MH pendant (250w) or a TEK light T-5 fixture. T-5's will keep the temps down but MH gives you that ocean shimmer. can grow pretty much anything under either so it really comes down to if you like the shimmer of MH but at the cost of possible heat problems in summer and needing a chiller (more $$ later on) hope this helps. any more questions feel free to ask! oh...and where are you located at? we have lots of mombers in the portland salem and eugen areas if you needed any 1 on 1 help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 24, 2007 Author Share Posted January 24, 2007 you want to match your return as closely as possible to what your skimmer can process. total water turnover is really overrated since if your skimmer can only process, say, 300 gallons an hour and your putting 600 gallons of water thru the sump then you are putting 300 gallons of unprocessed water back into the display. I'm pretty sure my skimmer can process 500-600 gph. I understand what you're saying, though. Bio balls are only good at trapping nitrates. a good bit of LR rubble and some chaeto or other macroalgae will do wonders in the fuge. Im not real familiar with that style of skimmer....it comes with bio balls in it? Yes, the skimmer (looks this way from the photo) has a narrow tube through the middle of it that is filled with bioballs, and I believe the water goes down through that tube and gets aerated/bubble-ized in the process. if the overflow box has a 1" hole then its capable of 1000 gallons per hour (someone correct me if im wrong?). one of the screw in type pc bulbs from home depot or walmart in a clamp on style lamp is fine for the fuge. Good. to get chaotic flow you can split your return line with a "Y" either in PVC or get LOC-LINE with two duckbill nozzles. maybe look at getting a hydor-flo rotating adapters to put on your powerheads for random flow. Okay, I'll explore this more. what kind of lighting are you using over your main display? I'd reccomed eitehr a MH pendant (250w) or a TEK light T-5 fixture. T-5's will keep the temps down but MH gives you that ocean shimmer. can grow pretty much anything under either so it really comes down to if you like the shimmer of MH but at the cost of possible heat problems in summer and needing a chiller (more $$ later on) I'll have to check. I believe its a total of 180 watts florescent in 4 tubes, 2 "white" and 2 "blue." I think it may be T-5 but I'm not certain. hope this helps. any more questions feel free to ask! oh...and where are you located at? we have lots of mombers in the portland salem and eugen areas if you needed any 1 on 1 help. Yes, very much, thanks. I live way up in Lynnwood, WA as a matter of fact. Are most people in Portland area, then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illcssd Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 I'm in vancouver as well as a few other people...no one real close to you. Isnt lynwood alot closer to seattle than pdx? if so you have a big seattle club up there, dont remember the site but one of these guys im sure knows it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R-3 Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 http://www.thepsas.org/ Great club from what I have seen. Check them out also! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael7979 Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Or www.reeffrointiers.com and look for the Puget Sound Aquarium Society forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 25, 2007 Author Share Posted January 25, 2007 Thanks for the links! I will definitely check these out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
180Brandy Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 (welcome) To the flip side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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